If You Must Drink Bottled Water...

[Princess Kae-Leah]

Is buying bottled water really worth the environmental impact? Educate yourself with the following bottled water facts:

*When it comes time to dispose of empty bottles, only about 25% are recycled, and the rest end up in our landfills. As a result, bottled water creates a large solid waste management burden.
*The energy cost of producing bottled water (taking into account manufacture, transport, and refrigeration) is more than 1,000 times the energy cost of producing tap water.

*Groundwater extraction sites can take a toll on local communities and the surrounding environment.


However, if you must drink bottled water, here are the top 10 best and worst brands according to Good Guide:

Top 10 Best:


Poland Spring-Overall Score: 8/10, Enviro: 7.9, Society: 6.2, Bottles Made of 100% Recycled PlasNestle Pure Life-Overall Score: 8/10, Enviro: 7.9, Society: 6.2, Bottles Made of 100% Recycled Plastictic
Arrowhead-Overall Score: 8/10, Enviro: 7.7, Society: 6.2, Bottles Made of 100% Recycled Plastic
Deer Park-Overall Score: 8/10, Enviro: 7.7, Society: 6.2, Bottles Made of 100% Recycled
Gerber Pure Water-Overall Score: 8/10, Enviro: 7.7, Society: 6.2
Ice Mountain-Overall Score: 8/10, Enviro: 7.7, Society: 6.2
Ozarka-Overall Score: 8/10, Enviro: 7.7, Society: 6.2
Re-Source Natural Spring Water-Overall Score: 8/10, Enviro: 7.7, Society: 6.2
Zephyrhills Distilled Water-Overall Score: 8/10, Enviro: 7.7, Society: 6.2
Calistoga Premium Water-Overall Score: 8/10, Enviro: 7.7, Society: 6.2


Top 10 Worst:


Voss Artesian Still Water-Enviro: 3.5 Society: 3.4
Shop Rite Spring Water-Enviro: 5.2, Society: 3.9
Gerolsteiner Naturell Water-Enviro: 5.9, Society: 3.8
Fiji Natural Artesian Water-Enviro: 5.8, Society: 4.1
Crystal Geyser Natural Alpine Spring Water-Enviro: 6.0, Society: 4.8
Walgreens Spring Water-Enviro: 6.2, Society: 5.1
Evian-Enviro: 5.9, Society: 6.0
Sam's Choice-Enviro: 7.0, Society: 5.0
Great Value-Enviro: 7.1, Society: 5.0
Snapple Spring Water-Enviro: 6.8, Society: 5.6


NOTE: I eliminated Nestle from the list per Iona's suggestion. While the bottles themselves may be made from 100% recycled plastic, there's still apparently a lot of problems with that company. The rankings are based on a website called Good Guide, so feel free to take it with a grain of salt in general.

[Theobromine]

Here's a short little video that illustrates the problems with bottled water in a memorable and easy to understand way:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Se12y9hSOM0

[Princess Kae-Leah]

Great video!!

[Seraphina Suds]

I found this at a local store and loved it! I hope it really catches on.
http://www.boxedwaterisbetter.com

Sent from my C6725 using Tapatalk

[Winged Mermaid]

REALLY surprised that Nestle is #1 on the "best". Nestle's bottling water practices are horrid, what with the CEO saying that water should not be a human right, (he says that's an "extreme solution") but privatized and sold.


"It's a question of whether we should privatize the normal water supply for the population. And there are two different opinions on the matter. The one opinion, which I think is extreme, is represented by the NGOs, who bang on about declaring water a public right. That means as a human being you should have a right to water. That's an extreme solution.

And the other view says that water is foodstuff like any other, and like any other foodstuff it should have a market value. Personally I believe it's better to give foodstuff a value so that we're all aware that is has its price, and then one should take specific measures for the part of the population that has no access to this water, and there are many different possibilities there. I'm still of the opinion that the biggest social responsibility of any CEO is to maintain and ensure the successful and profitable future of his enterprise." -Nestle CEO (http://www.trueactivist.com/nestle-ceo-water-is-not-a-human-right-should-be-privatized/)



NOT ONLY THAT, but they're bottling ground water from national forest in California- a state stricken with sever drought and crippling water shortages- with a permit that expired 27 years ago!

There's way worse to do with that company, but I won't get into it. I know this thread is supposed to be about the bottles themselves, but the water should have a lot to do with it too. They don't deserve to be on the "best" companies list at all IMO. I hope you'll consider striking them from the list in your original post.

[Theobromine]

There is also a full length documentary called Bag It about the hazards of plastics and how ubiquitous they are, but I like the bottled water video because it's much easier to encourage people to watch. I would say definitely DON'T buy bottled water at all, and that is why. It's just so easy to get and use reusable water bottles, there is really no excuse not to other than laziness. Sorry if that offends anyone, but it's true. I know there are areas where the water is not safe to drink, but there are better solutions than buying bottled water--water filters and sterilizers, for example. There are many different options for all different budgets. For example, I have a Steri-Pen that is made for backpacking and traveling, and it uses a small UV bulb to sterilize a bottle of water in under a minute. I used it when I went to Bali (where the tap water isn't potable, and all the guidebooks tell you to just buy bottled water) and I didn't get sick once, nor did I buy a single bottle of water. It's actually a lot more convenient than having to buy and carry a bunch of disposable water bottles; you can just keep the Steri-Pen in your backpack or purse and use it any time you need to replenish your water supply, rather than having to plan your trip around stores where you can buy bottled water. I'm honestly kinda shocked more people don't use them.

[Winged Mermaid]

I found this at a local store and loved it! I hope it really catches on.
http://www.boxedwaterisbetter.com

Sent from my C6725 using Tapatalk

Love this idea!

[Theobromine]

You can check out the Steri-Pen (http://www.steripen.com/) website, their cheapest model costs $50, which if you think about it is less than what someone who buys bottled water regularly can spend in just a short amount of time. You can also use a prefilter if there is sediment in the water, and/or activated carbon to remove toxins.

[Theobromine]

The boxed water is definitely preferable to bottled water, true, but it still has the issue of disposable packaging (still creating waste) and paying for water (which I just think is nuts). Disposable plastics are definitely the worst choice, environmentally speaking, but filters and sterilizers are the best choice, as they are very much reusable.

[Theobromine]

And Iona has an excellent point about the contents of the water bottle, not just the packaging. Plus the CEO of Nestle is a total butthole :P

[Princess Kae-Leah]

Thanks for the heads up, mer-sisters!!! This is based on a website called Good Guide which ranks products by how healthy, eco-friendly, and socially responsible they are. They gave Nestle a high ranking because they use a lot of recycled plastic, but like you said, that doesn't solve the other problems. I eliminated Nestle Pure Life from the list as per suggestion.

[Theobromine]

Maybe Good Guide has good intentions but aren't so good at doing their homework :thinks:

[Ciriun]

I checked out my favorite brand, Gerolsteiner, on their site and they don't really explain why a given product gets the scores that it does. For instance this brand was tagged as having something wrong with the material of the container, but I couldn't find an explanation of what was wrong with it.

Anyway, I don't intend to switch unless I find another brand of mineral water that actually lists the mineral content somewhere on the bottle. And I don't drink it as my main source of water, it's something of a treat and a six pack can last me for a couple of months at least.

[Cordelia]

It's just so easy to get and use reusable water bottles, there is really no excuse not to other than laziness. Sorry if that offends anyone, but it's true. I know there are areas where the water is not safe to drink, but there are better solutions than buying bottled water--water filters and sterilizers, for example.

It is not actually true in all cases. A company in my home town decided it would be totally cool if they just buried some chemical waste in the landfill. A lot of people got very sick due to those chemicals leaching into the water table. I doubt many people in that area could afford a water filter or sterilizer potent enough to clean chemical waste from their tap water, and I doubt that they were being lazy about trying to obtain safe drinking water by buying bottled water. My point is, just be careful using extreme words to back up your arguments. I understand being passionate about a cause, but if there is one exception, then you run the risk of weakening your entire case and offending people.

__

On a side note: I saw that quote from the Nestle CEO a few months ago. How does he even have a job? :O_o:

[Princess Kae-Leah]

My mom chooses to drink bottled water because she's kind of a germaphobe, but the thing is, there's health risks from drinking in plastic too, such as carcinogens(sp?) leaching out

[Ciriun]

Don't some places sell big jugs of water that you can bring back in to get them refilled? I swear I've seen them somewhere, and it seems to me that would be a good compromise for people who just want better drinking water.

[SeaGlass Siren]

I avoid all water bottles in general. Brita water filter bottles have made it so much easier to cut back on plastic. Only drawback is that I don't know where to throw out the used filters to replace new ones.

[Theobromine]

It is not actually true in all cases. A company in my home town decided it would be totally cool if they just buried some chemical waste in the landfill. A lot of people got very sick due to those chemicals leaching into the water table. I doubt many people in that area could afford a water filter or sterilizer potent enough to clean chemical waste from their tap water, and I doubt that they were being lazy about trying to obtain safe drinking water by buying bottled water. My point is, just be careful using extreme words to back up your arguments. I understand being passionate about a cause, but if there is one exception, then you run the risk of weakening your entire case and offending people.

You make a valid point, and that could be the subject of a whole separate post. I realize there are areas where the water table is severely contaminated and most people are very poor and wouldn't consider purchasing reusable filters, but my point still stands that they actually spend MORE on bottled water since they have to buy it constantly (obviously these people mostly don't qualify as lazy, that wasn't meant to be a blanket statement or apply to extreme cases). And the ultimate solution for these types of pollution problems is to cut off the source of the pollution, such as by banning fracking and tightening regulations on chemical waste disposal. Again, I could write a whole article on THAT issue, but I'm pretty sure the original post was aimed more at those of us who have the luxury of hanging out on mermaid forums and comparing and contrasting bottled water brands, not people who live in extreme poverty in highly polluted areas.

[Winged Mermaid]

You make a valid point, and that could be the subject of a whole separate post. I realize there are areas where the water table is severely contaminated and most people are very poor and wouldn't consider purchasing reusable filters, but my point still stands that they actually spend MORE on bottled water since they have to buy it constantly (obviously these people mostly don't qualify as lazy, that wasn't meant to be a blanket statement or apply to extreme cases). And the ultimate solution for these types of pollution problems is to cut off the source of the pollution, such as by banning fracking and tightening regulations on chemical waste disposal. Again, I could write a whole article on THAT issue, but I'm pretty sure the original post was aimed more at those of us who have the luxury of hanging out on mermaid forums and comparing and contrasting bottled water brands, not people who live in extreme poverty in highly polluted areas.

True that. There are whole chunks of my home state, WV, where people spend nearly all their income on bottled water becuase the water is so dangerous from chemicals and whatnot. They can't even wash their clothes or dishes in the water, they have to use bottled water. All because of mountian top removal :( Friends of coal can go f*** themsleves sideways with a cactus for destroying my home state and endangering the lives of people who live there. "Clean coal" my a**. No such god d*** thing. F***ers. :anger explode:
Not to mention the chemical plants that dump into rivers there and coal companies having chemical spills that make the water completely unsafe for multiple counties. It happened TWICE there in 2014, got nation wide coverage. People had to buy bottled water for months. /rant

Also there are people with the same illness I have, they're so sensitive that anything other than bottled water puts them in an enormous amount of pain. I encourage them to buy a reverse osmosis filter that ionizes and mineralizes the water. It's expensive (about $1k) but if you think long term you'll be saving money for sure, and it's actually much healthier than bottled water for an number of reasons. I'm just thankful I can get by with a water filter pitcher. I rarely buy bottled water, if I do it's the Essentia bottled water that helps me when I'm having a flare. I'm hoping to buy one of those filtration systems myself one day. I keep saving for it, but you know how life takes away savings left and right. I still use reusable bottles :) Lost mine recently (my husband lost his too) so we're reusing 2 essentia bottles and going to be ordering more camelbak bottles soon ^_^

Camelbak sells bottles that have filters built in too! So if you want filtered tap water on the go, there's your solution! My mom has one and loves it!

[Cordelia]

They don't live in an area of high poverty, and it shouldn't have been that polluted. I just doubt that a Brita water filter or even an RO water filter system is powerful enough to clean water that has been compromised by the unfortunate levels of chemicals. (And you can bet that I was super glad that my parents chose not to move into that subdivision 35+ years ago. Eep!) But you are right, there is enough fodder for quite a few more threads with this topic. Sadly. :(

@Ciriun Yes, there are places to get large bottles of water. I know Jewel usually has a spot to refill the... I think they are 5 gallon jugs. There are a few companies who also do deliveries. I'm not sure what is available in your area though.

[Echidna]

Is this about plastic bottles?
Because the majority of bottles sold here are glass and multi-used.

It's fair and square to advocate tap water if you have the luxury of living in a region where tap water is safe and potable.
Many countries in the world, and yes developed ones too, cannot claim that.

But NO tap water is free from harmful chemicals brought by drugs that people use, because drugs cannot be filtered with current technology.
If you have an illness, taking that surplus of painkillers and hormonal drugs can push you over the edge.

As long as tapwater is not safe in that regard, I'm not drinking it.

And while we're at it; this drug surplus also flows into rivers, lakes and all other water systems, causing health problems for many aquatic animals up to the point they cannot reproduce and die out.

[SeaGlass Siren]

There's glass bottles here as well ;0 for bougie perrier water :p

as for tap water, generally speaking I think NA (more so canada) water is pretty ok compared to other parts of the world where the tap water isn't actually potable. (Omg something I learned from grade 7 is actually useful) so I've been able to get by just using Brita filters.

[Theobromine]

You certainly can filter drugs and other chemicals out of water; it's quite easy to do with activated carbon...we use it in aquarium filters to remove residual medications after a treatment course, and to remove other chemicals and toxins as well. And there are some water bottles that do come with a small built-in charcoal filter! I think that's what is in a lot of the other water pitcher filters as well (I'd have to look into that more as I don't really use them, personally).

Also, regarding poor people who live in developing nations or regions where tap water is unsafe (or even groundwater); people have been specifically tackling that problem by developing low-cost, ultra-portable water filters for that exact purpose. There's a company called LifeStraw that makes and sells these products, and when you buy any of their products, they actually donate water filters to schoolchildren in Kenya: http://www.buylifestraw.com/en/the-cause (I actually forgot about this until just now, I think I might buy one myself!)

[Theobromine]

Also, has everyone watched that video I posted yesterday? Cuz most bottled water IS actually just tap water. :P

[Echidna]

You certainly can filter drugs and other chemicals out of water; it's quite easy to do with activated carbon...

In that case, you are ahead of the rest of the world, because currently, scientists are working on a way to filter hormones with enzymes and it's nowhere near finished.

I know you find dozens of sites saying their filters clean everything, however these are the sellers of said filters.
Here's an excerpt from a scientific site regarding this issue:


With such contaminants proving elusive to municipal filtration systems, the burden of protection often lies with the end user. But getting traces of birth control and other drugs out of your tap water isn’t so easy. Of the many different kinds of in-home water filtration systems available today, only those employing reverse osmosis have been shown to filter out some drugs. Some makers of activated carbon water filters claim their products catch pharmaceuticals, but independent research has not verified such claims.

from http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/birth-control-in-water-supply/

Btw, our town has the latest, most expensive carbon filters installed, but even those are incapable of filtering enzymes, drugs and hormons out of the water.
It would need nanotechnology for that.

[SeaGlass Siren]

well. at least they're working on it.

http://i1.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/facebook/000/005/600/its-something.jpg

[Echidna]

Yea, and they had better hurry :p

Nano particles are a problem too, and they've spread everywhere now and clogging up the food chain as they are mistaken for plankton.

[Theobromine]

Echidna, you don't actually need nanotechnology for that. The article you posted also mentions reverse osmosis systems, which are highly effective, as is steam distillation. Both of these purification methods remove VERY tiny ionic compounds, as well as larger organic molecules (such as hormones and enzymes). Sure, not all home water purifiers use this technology, but the point is, the technology exists and isn't even that complex. Aquariums and zoos (I've worked at several) use reverse osmosis/deionization (commonly termed RO/DI) filters to make completely purified water for extremely sensitive aquatic organisms. And steam distillation can be as simple as boiling a pot on the stove, catching the steam in a container, and then putting the container in a cold area to allow the steam to condense.

Here is an article from the CDC describing the efficacy of various water purification methods: http://www.cdc.gov/healthywater/drinking/travel/household_water_treatment.html

If you guys want, I can do as much in-depth primary source research as necessary (primary sources being research studies published in peer-reviewed journals; it's important to go to the primary research source because many popular news sites often misinterpret or misconstrue or oversimplify the facts...this is a huge pet peeve of scientists everywhere, don't even get me started :soap box:). That way we can all be on the same page and won't have to argue over the little details. Just...I'll do that later, I had a hyperactive kitten playing soccer under my bed since the wee hours of the morning :bed now:

[SeaGlass Siren]

^this. primary research for everything.

[Theobromine]

Also, by nano particles do you mean microplastics? Because if so, then you're correct that they're a huge issue with being mistaken for food particles by small organisms and thus ending up contaminating the food web. But let's just make sure we have clear definitions here: nanoparticle is just a term that refers to any particle that is between 1 and 100 nanometers in diameter. One micron=1000 nanometers. If you refer to the CDC webpage I linked earlier, you'll see that "A reverse osmosis filter has a pore size of approximately 0.0001 micron" and 0.0001 micron = 0.1 nanometer, so reverse osmosis definitely filters out nanoparticles. Hooray!

[Theobromine]

^this. primary research for everything.
:thumbs-up:

[Theobromine]

On, and one more thing real quick, for now. I just asked my dad about this to make sure I was on the right track with my explanations (he's a leading environmental scientist at an environmental consulting firm that does a lot of sediment toxicity analysis) and this was the quick answer he gave me:
"Medications and hormones are certainly present in wastewater, and some amount at least passes through municipal wastewater treatment systems. I wouldn't expect these in groundwater wells unless they have been contaminated relatively recently. Most organic chemicals are carbon and energy sources for bacteria (not all, certainly), so I would not expect those kinds of things to persist for very long in groundwater. Activated carbon and reverse osmosis should do a good job of removing such large organic molecules (though physical filtration would not)."

[Aziara]

They don't live in an area of high poverty, and it shouldn't have been that polluted. I just doubt that a Brita water filter or even an RO water filter system is powerful enough to clean water that has been compromised by the unfortunate levels of chemicals. (And you can bet that I was super glad that my parents chose not to move into that subdivision 35+ years ago. Eep!) But you are right, there is enough fodder for quite a few more threads with this topic. Sadly. :(

@Ciriun Yes, there are places to get large bottles of water. I know Jewel usually has a spot to refill the... I think they are 5 gallon jugs. There are a few companies who also do deliveries. I'm not sure what is available in your area though.

This seems to be the case in all of Louisiana too, sadly. My mom had her kidneys basically destroyed by drinking tap water. Even the city water where I live now has lead and arsenic in it (not to mention flouride and chlorine).

[Randolph2]

I solved the issue of bottled water simply by using filters to purify water in the refrigerator, on the site https://filterway.com/refrigerator-filters/kitchenaid/ there are almost all popular models that you can order and then install yourself, and what are you about half a year you get tasty water without bad impurities.