If Not Alex then what.... ?

[Mermaid Citrine]

I've been searching all the threads about tail-making with latex and cannot find the answer to this question....

if there are hazards to using Alex then what type of latex are people using for realistic tails ?

I want to make a realistic tail and do the neoprene with latex scales over it but can only find all the info about Alex and its potential hazards,
so if there another type of latex ppl are painting over-top of their neoprene to make realistic tails from or is the next step up pure silicone (which seems very expensive and difficult)

Please help, Thanks !

[Mermaid Citrine]

On a related note....I currently have made 2 tails from spandex that I painted at the fluke...I really love my current designs and was wondering if anyone has had success just paiting clear latex or silicone over-top a fabric tail to make it thicker and more durable ??

thanks

[Mermaid Cascada]

I'm sorry that I can't answer your second question but You can get you later from Monstermakers or there are some options on the making tails page. You can find it at the top of the page :D good luck

[Spindrift]

You can follow the same techniques and tutorials of ALEX but replace it with slip casting latex (and if needed, some latex thickener). It's a lot safer and durable.

[Mermaid Crystal]

You can get latex from monstersmakers.com and people used spray silicone to have a longer tail life

[Mermaid Arianna]

If you wanted to put something over your current tail it would have to be silicone since there is no such thing as entirely clear latex, it would be yellowish, but if that doesn't bug you latex would work.

[Mermaid Citrine]

Thanks everyone !

so on this link at monstermakers its called "mask making latex" is that the same/different from slip casting latex Spindrift ? If so, how different ?
My next question was going to be if the application techniques are the same as what Capt. Nemo and MelBel showed in their latex tail tutorials....thanks for answering that...I'll experiment on some swatches of neoprene first to get it right....on that note besides Nemo and MelBel are there any other latex tail tutorials out there that I haven't found ?

http://www.monstermakers.com/category/slush-latex-casting-latex-mask-latex-RD407-latex-Compounds/

I'm excited ! I've been putting off trying a realistic tail for a while now...but after getting to see some in person at Mer-Palooza I'm motivated to try my own :)
Thanks to everyone thats been helpful to the community by sharing their techniques/successes and failures :) :)

[Winged Mermaid]

What they said! Slip casting latex. If you thicken it with latex thickener it can be used the same as ALEX. In my opinion it's well worth it for your health and the longevity of the materials. There's a bit about it on the Materials and Supplies page under "Using latex and silicone on neoprene": http://mernetwork.com/index/content.php?139-Materials-and-Supplies

I know the Canadian Mermaid Marie "silicones herself in" to her fabric tails. Basically she wears the tail and puts tin cure silicone (such as GE Silicone II clear) over the fabric to turn it into a more durable tail. However I think this is extremely unwise. Tin cure silicone is very toxic while wet as well, and to a point after it cures, and wearing it while it soaks through the fabric and cures while in contact with you skin can be extremely dangerous and would not recommend it to ANYONE! You can take a feather from her hat, but please stuff your tail with towels or something to give it shape if you wish to do this. Otherwise, go with the least dangerous rote and do it with platinum silicone. However tin cure or platinum, silicone will discolor over time- eventually to yellow then to brown. So keep that in mind.

[Spindrift]

Thanks everyone !

so on this link at monstermakers its called "mask making latex" is that the same/different from slip casting latex Spindrift ? If so, how different ?
My next question was going to be if the application techniques are the same as what Capt. Nemo and MelBel showed in their latex tail tutorials....thanks for answering that...I'll experiment on some swatches of neoprene first to get it right....on that note besides Nemo and MelBel are there any other latex tail tutorials out there that I haven't found ?

http://www.monstermakers.com/category/slush-latex-casting-latex-mask-latex-RD407-latex-Compounds/

I'm excited ! I've been putting off trying a realistic tail for a while now...but after getting to see some in person at Mer-Palooza I'm motivated to try my own :)
Thanks to everyone thats been helpful to the community by sharing their techniques/successes and failures :) :)

I'm pretty sure you can use that. The brand I use is on Amazon and you can just search for the latex on there. Just remember that latex is opaque, and not translucent. So embedding glitter in it might not work as well. But you can hand paint or airbrush really amazing colors on to it. Just heat set the paint (carefully so as to not ruin the neoprene) and put a sealant on top (like permawet). I haven't experimented with the permawet step yet, but everything else seems to have worked pretty well for me.

[Winged Mermaid]

There's a link on the Materials and Supplies page for the latex supplier that Raven uses, and was recommended by others who work with latex as well. For more tutorials and info check out the Tailmaking Reference Index sticky (http://mernetwork.com/index/showthread.php?2633-%E2%98%86%E2%9A%A0TAILMAKING-REFERENCE-INDEX%E2%9A%A0%E2%98%86-Look-here-BEFORE-you-post-any-questions%21).

[Ayla of Duluth]

isn't Alex only dangerous to use until it fully cures?

[Winged Mermaid]

That's debatable, a controversy of the community, I guess you could say. But there's a reason that tin cure latex and tin cure silicone (let alone caulking which has a cocktail of other harsh chemicals) isn't approved for wear and is not considered "skin safe" like slip casting latex and platinum cure silicone is.

In fact if someone decided to, they could make a lot of money by suing every tail maker that uses the stuff (even class action law suits) so that should tell you something.

A lot of the times things that are considered "safe" in our society are actually dangerous to your health, especially with repeated exposure and contact. For something to have that many warnings on it saying that it's not.. well it makes you think what level of toxicity it really has. I personally think people need to get away from it, but as it is people who make these kind of things will always use materials out of spec. If you want to take that chance yourself, that's your issue. I think that if someone decides to sell the tails made from it they need to tell the person that they're not using a skin safe material. It's the right thing to do ethically, first of all, and second they could end up getting sued for it if the customer doesn't know what they're agreeing to buy. I think it's great more tail makers are are coming into the scene, but get AWAY from this caulking stuff already! It's not considered safe and it doesn't hold up well. So that's my input on it.

[Mermaid Photine]

@ post #8
Perhaps make a duct tape form of the legs and torso (there's a thread on that somewhere) and then silicone over that? I would probably be easier, too. I had a terrible time making my dummy for my painted tail. I didn't have anyone to help out, and the duct tape I already had put down made it really difficult to know if I had properly taped the back of my legs and bum. (Also, I left my scissors ALL the way on the other side of the room. I had to hop. xD )

[Mermaid Citrine]

Thanks Winged Mermaid. I don't know how but I didn't see that "materials" link before. So it sounds like "Burn Man" latex is the slip-casting latex but I have to get a thickener also if I use that one...I don't want to make a mold, I just want to apply the latex to the neoprene like in Mel Bel and Nemo's tutorials....so for that I wonder if Burn Man Slip casting latex or Monster Makers mask making latex is better....hmmm

[Winged Mermaid]

I've been told that they're pretty much the same. There's some technical details that make the latex act slightly different for specific needs, but it's to do with (as far as I can tell) stuff that doesn't concern the process we're using. You'll need thickener no matter which one you buy. There's a few dollars in price difference between the two suppliers, but I'd check both of them to see how much of a difference in shipping price there is (one may be cheaper or closer to you than the other). The good thing is that the thickener is cheap!

[Mermaid Citrine]

Great ! Thanks !