i have a crazy idea

[Pascal21M]

Its hard to find a place in winter where i can swim as a mermaid. I will buy a area with a house and make there a mermaid school where you can swim only as a mermaid. What do you think about this idea and who will support me?

[sashiyoop]

I think it's an interesting concept, but I have a few questions:

~Where will you get the money to start it (purchase the house, maintain the pool, advertisements, ect.)
~What would you teach at a mermaid school exactly?
~In order to keep it running (unless you have a stash of money at your disposal), you're going to have to charge. How many people do you expect to enroll, and how much do you plan on charging them?

Don't get me wrong, I love the idea and would adore to have something like that where I'm at, but planning is essential.

[Pascal21M]

Hy

I will gain money from crowdfunding. I will teach there how to act like a mermaid, swim like mermaid etc. It should come about 750 per day and they should pay 40 $ Admisson. I think all of this project will cost 2.000.000 $.
When I earn without all taxes 20 $ (I calculate 350 persons a day for the first year) I will become the price of the project in 9 Yrs. But I need somrbody to help me figure this out. I will built this house near the Chiemsee in Germany because its between two large cities.

[MermaidNadia]

I've been having the same idea lately, but money is a serious issue. You will not get 350 people to come per day, especially the first year. Mermaiding is getting popular, but not THAT popular. Also, a 40€ admission cost is REALLY high. If I would want to go for a swim with my girls there, i would have to dish out 120€ per day! You need to think of another way to fund it, like asking for donations from the european mermaid community first, to get an idea of actual numbers, who would really be interested, etc.
good luck!

[Pascal21M]

Its 30 €. How will interested to donate me some money to realize it

[Yulia]

Will it be an outside pool or inside?
Because if you want to swim in the winter you'll have to pay for the poolheating if it's outside.

[Pascal21M]

I will make both

[Echidna]

Ehm.
Do you have any experience in business running and funding, and/or about pools?

Pools cost a fortune to build, maintain, and heat.
If you make a "mers-only"-pool, while very appealing to us, you won't ever get enough customers to recover the costs, simply because there are not enough mers.

Also, you will have to compete with several mermaid swimming schools and clubs who already exist in southern Germany, who teach mermaiding in classes a whole lot cheaper than what you imagine.

I like your idea, but I don't think it's feasible, unless you are in the pool manufacturing business and also quite rich.

What might work, however, and would give mermaiding quite a nice boost, is a pool complex especially suited for mermaiding (greater depth, warmer than usual, shallow places in the water to lay), which is open to the public at a reasonable price;
and everyone who shows up with a tail & mer costume will only pay half.

This way, you could recover the costs, attract mers, AND have mers being an attraction for other guests all in one.

[Pascal21M]

What do you think it will cost??

[Pascal21M]

No i have no expierence

[Echidna]

What do you think it will cost??

Depending on size, number and depth of pools, extras (waterfalls, grottos, underwater lighting...),
could be anything between 3 and 10 million € (unless it's a really small building with an even smaller pool).

I don't know what the maintaining costs would be, that's calculated from the watervolume and temperature,
and depends also on the facility/building.

You'd also have to factor in the wages of people you have to employ- technicians, lifeguards, cleaning personnel, cashiers...

[Pascal21M]

Can you help me to create a business plan? Or anybody other?

[Mermaid Momo]

I sort of skimmed through this thread but what I'm thinking from your post is that it will be like a summer camp but all year round? Right?


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[Merman Arion]

Hy

I will gain money from crowdfunding. I will teach there how to act like a mermaid, swim like mermaid etc. It should come about 750 per day and they should pay 40 $ Admisson. I think all of this project will cost 2.000.000 $.
When I earn without all taxes 20 $ (I calculate 350 persons a day for the first year) I will become the price of the project in 9 Yrs. But I need somrbody to help me figure this out. I will built this house near the Chiemsee in Germany because its between two large cities.

Mmmh.
I will be honest, i don't believe in such a project when you are 21 with no experience BUT good luck if you decide to do it anyway. :thumbs-up:

[Pascal21M]

What do you mean draggersprez?

[Blondie]

Hy

I will gain money from crowdfunding. I will teach there how to act like a mermaid, swim like mermaid etc. It should come about 750 per day and they should pay 40 $ Admisson. I think all of this project will cost 2.000.000 $.
When I earn without all taxes 20 $ (I calculate 350 persons a day for the first year) I will become the price of the project in 9 Yrs. But I need somrbody to help me figure this out. I will built this house near the Chiemsee in Germany because its between two large cities.

No offense and all but 350 people a day is not a very accurate number. I've worked at a waterpark for years in Florida and we might get that many people in half a week to a week. And that's in sunny Florida. And this is a very classy and pretty waterpark. But we don't get numbers like that unless it's the fourth of july or some other summer holiday. Plus, if this is a mermaid only swimming area, you're looking at a looooot less people.

If you are truly serious about this, you should focus on saving money and working out all of these kinks. Maybe make fabric tails to rent to people while they are there so that they don't have to buy or bring their own if they're not serious about mermaiding but what to have fun. And you also mentioned that you don't have any experience, which isn't bad, it's just you need to really plan this out. Making something like this will be a SERIOUS commitment. You'll probably have to invest a lot of money into it. It won't be a, "ohhh! I'm going to make swim house today because it's fun!" thing.

Maybe get some experience by working at a small business or a local pool. It doesn't sound like you know a lot about what you're getting yourself into. Work on getting some experience and developing a business plan in the mean time before starting a donation for this.

[Pascal21M]

Then help me to realize it.
I think it can be realized

[Mermaid Momo]

What do you mean draggersprez?

Do they have summer camps where you live? Basically during the summer for sometimes a week to a few months kids (and adults) go to a summer camp. It's a camp site or getaway where they live in cabins or whatever place they are provided, the camp feeds them and stuff and you do lots of activities like fishing, swimming, kayaking, crafts ,etc (it all depends on what type of camp)

There are lots of different kinds of camps like camps for burn victims, camps for disabled children, camps for trans* kids and their parents, camps for gay kids, band camps, etc.


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[Pascal21M]

Yes we can make it like that
But with the grotta??

[Pascal21M]

What do you mean how many should come to the park that the money will come back Blondie!!

[Blondie]

What do you mean how many should come to the park that the money will come back Blondie!!
Well, seeing you're in Austria, I don't know how popular swimming is there. Since I live in Florida, swimming is a MAJOR thing here. Kids grow up in the water here. Plus it doesn't snow here, so you can basically swim year round outside. But I don't know how it is like in your area. If swimming a really popular thing, you'll probably have a steady business, especially if it's indoors. But if swimming is not practiced at all in the winter, you're going to have to figure out something to do in that part of the year. 40€ does seem a lot too me. Personally, I would charge 10€ per person. Maybe 15€ but anything over 20 would be very pricey for a one day swim.

[Pascal21M]

By us iz snows in the winter months. Is 15 euro not to less?? You must finance it. Swimming is also popular by us but no so popular as by you

[Blondie]

I mean it depends on what kind of attractions you would have there. If you're going to have just some pools, it's not going to be worth much more than 15-20 euro per person a day. Because they could always swim somewhere else for cheaper or free. If you're adding stuff like, waterfalls, slides, more entertainment, then maybe you can charge more.

I'm just saying my opinion, if someone charged a person in Florida $40 to swim at a pool, they would walk right out of there. Waterparks here don't even charge $40 for a swim. Something between 15 and 25 would be reasonable.

[Pascal21M]

It should be there only pools indoor and outdoor with caves and grotts. This should be curvy.

[MerEmma]

I mean it depends on what kind of attractions you would have there. If you're going to have just some pools, it's not going to be worth much more than 15-20 euro per person a day. Because they could always swim somewhere else for cheaper or free. If you're adding stuff like, waterfalls, slides, more entertainment, then maybe you can charge more.

I'm just saying my opinion, if someone charged a person in Florida $40 to swim at a pool, they would walk right out of there. Waterparks here don't even charge $40 for a swim. Something between 15 and 25 would be reasonable.

Really? Huh. The waterparks around here charge $50-$60 a ticket, but public pools tend to be $5-$10.

[Pascal21M]

I will open it all with discounts for mermaids and mermen

[Merman Dan]

I have always wanted a swimming pool like Shark Reef at Typhoon Lagoon (https://disneyworld.disney.go.com/attractions/typhoon-lagoon/shark-reef/). Combine that with a lazy river and then we're talking!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2spNbq3ZT1k

[roamingmer]

There are various tutorials on how to construct a business plan online, and you have got some good advice from Blondie. Hohen Sie, was Sie sagts ist immer richtig.

Have a look at various large water parks in Europe - Europarks or CentreParks can give you an idea of the type of environment needed to house multiple warm pools throughout the winter, and obviously summer is easier. Here in Switzerland a yearly pass to an outdoor pool is about 80 USD-120 USD. A summer pass to 20 outdoor heated pools in Zurich area is around 160 USD. A day pass to a large complex max 20 USD per person. Heavily motivated swimmers will visit the pool every day, but most will attend when the sun is out and water is warm.

So lets start backwards & forwards costing to see what is feasible. Take a large outdoor pool complex (children pool, slides, diving boards, 50m pool, toddler pool) which probably gets max 100 people a day on a 30C day. 50% of the people have a summer pass (120 USD split over 20 weeks = 6 USD / day / person). Thats 300 USD for 50 people. The other 50 pay a daily entrance fee of 8 USD. Thats 400 USD. So total takings per day would be 700 USD in principle.

Now take off the wages of the two life guards who are present. They are paid 50 USD / hour. The pool is open for 9 hours. Thats 900 USD outgoing per day. You are already negative 200 USD, so no-go.
Now take off the heating costs - just for the office (280 USD / month = 10 USD / day approx). Now the pool heating costs, repair costs and you can easily be in the region of another 100 USD / day.
Hmm... not looking good.
Remember cleaning costs... income tax on your net income, social security costs for your employees, public liability insurance (even if it is a members only club), advertising (probably 20% of your income), electricity, gas, building maintainence, changing rooms, security. You could easily be right that you need 350 people / day at 40 USD to make it work - but the answer is clear. It is not going to work in this scenario. It is a nice dream, and if you win the Lotto then good luck setting it up - but it will be a bottomless moneypit unless you have a secret ingredient.

Sorry...

[Echidna]

I'm pretty sure that the outdoor pool I'm visiting had lots more than just 100 guests per warm day.
Sure, we only get a handful of warm days, weeks at most, but both the pool and all its surroundings are simply swarming with people- think Rush-Hour subway in a large city.

It might be less for an area with more competition pool-wise- in Bavaria are not only more pools than where I live, but also many nice lakes-, but in general, German pools tend to be full.

That said, I think pools that do less well are subsidized by the municipalities.
At any rate, even though this idea obviously needs lots of planning, it might not be impossible to do
if a city/municipality can be convinced of the merit of such a new facility.

[MerEmma]

The amount of people that visit a pool TOTALLY depends on location and time of year. It's really hard to estimate.

[Mermaid Sparkle]

There are various tutorials on how to construct a business plan online, and you have got some good advice from Blondie. Hohen Sie, was Sie sagts ist immer richtig.

Have a look at various large water parks in Europe - Europarks or CentreParks can give you an idea of the type of environment needed to house multiple warm pools throughout the winter, and obviously summer is easier. Here in Switzerland a yearly pass to an outdoor pool is about 80 USD-120 USD. A summer pass to 20 outdoor heated pools in Zurich area is around 160 USD. A day pass to a large complex max 20 USD per person. Heavily motivated swimmers will visit the pool every day, but most will attend when the sun is out and water is warm.

So lets start backwards & forwards costing to see what is feasible. Take a large outdoor pool complex (children pool, slides, diving boards, 50m pool, toddler pool) which probably gets max 100 people a day on a 30C day. 50% of the people have a summer pass (120 USD split over 20 weeks = 6 USD / day / person). Thats 300 USD for 50 people. The other 50 pay a daily entrance fee of 8 USD. Thats 400 USD. So total takings per day would be 700 USD in principle.

Now take off the wages of the two life guards who are present. They are paid 50 USD / hour. The pool is open for 9 hours. Thats 900 USD outgoing per day. You are already negative 200 USD, so no-go.
Now take off the heating costs - just for the office (280 USD / month = 10 USD / day approx). Now the pool heating costs, repair costs and you can easily be in the region of another 100 USD / day.
Hmm... not looking good.
Remember cleaning costs... income tax on your net income, social security costs for your employees, public liability insurance (even if it is a members only club), advertising (probably 20% of your income), electricity, gas, building maintainence, changing rooms, security. You could easily be right that you need 350 people / day at 40 USD to make it work - but the answer is clear. It is not going to work in this scenario. It is a nice dream, and if you win the Lotto then good luck setting it up - but it will be a bottomless moneypit unless you have a secret ingredient.

Sorry...

HOLY COW. 50 USD/hr? That seems way over-priced. The minimum wage in my state is 7.78/hr. I would think Lifeguards AT MOST, would get 12/hr. That's only 100/day/lifeguard.

I'm a restaurant owner and I think it's a feasible idea. As long as it has something to keep people coming in to visit (like mermaids). If you called it mermaid paradise and advertised it as a place where mermaids could come swim and people could come visit and watch. Maybe keep one mermaid employed in the pool at all times.
Your large costs are mainly going to be upkeep, as I can see.
All you need is a loan and a plan to get it going.

[Blondie]

Really? Huh. The waterparks around here charge $50-$60 a ticket, but public pools tend to be $5-$10.
Well.... You're right. You live in central Florida too so you have some of the best waterparks out there. Here in Jax we don't have a lot and they're no where near the scale at which the ones in like, Orlando are.

So yeah I guess you're right. For a NICE and really fun waterpark it'll be more like $50-60. This is slides, wavepools, other crazy water attractions. Not just pools.


Now take off the wages of the two life guards who are present. They are paid 50 USD / hour. The pool is open for 9 hours. Thats 900 USD outgoing per day. You are already negative 200 USD, so no-go.

Whoaaaa no. Lifeguards get NOTHING close to that. I was a lifeguard for three years and I got $10 an hour. Some beach lifeguards might make between $12-17 USD an hour. But I have NEVER met one who has made over $20 an hour. The one who I met who made that much had been working at the beach and was one of the captains of the guard in the city. And he had been doing it for years, plus he was following in the footsteps of his father. $50 an hour is waaaaay out there. My mother is an ICU nurse and she doesn't even get close to that amount.

But overall, I agree with your business plan. It doesn't seem plausible to me either. It does seem like a cool dream and would be fun to do if you had endless boatloads of cash, but that's just not realistic.

[MerEmma]

Well.... You're right. You live in central Florida too so you have some of the best waterparks out there. Here in Jax we don't have a lot and they're no where near the scale at which the ones in like, Orlando are.

So yeah I guess you're right. For a NICE and really fun waterpark it'll be more like $50-60. This is slides, wavepools, other crazy water attractions. Not just pools.



I forget that there's such a thing as smaller waterparks, bahaha. I've only been to big Disney/Busch/SeaWorld waterparks and I forgot that there are smaller waterparks that charge less. Total mistake. :P

[MerAnthony]

I know that there is one like you describe here in th U.S. I talk to her from time to time. I am not sure where she is located but I bet it is in a warmer area of the U.S.

[Pascal21M]

It shouldnt be a waterpark just a similiar pool
Who will donate for it when it will be able to realize

[Pascal21M]

What do you think about this pool: http://urbex2011.files.wordpress.com/2013/06/img_6927.jpg ??
Do you think we can modernize it?

[MerEmma]

A pool like that is pretty dang big--very expensive to operate.

[roamingmer]

Perhaps Pascal21M is actually a visionary - someone who drive an idea no matter what. So go for it.

Sorry I should have stated that prices in USD are based on a (nearly) 1:1 conversion from Swiss Francs. A physical therapist will earn 100 USD / hour (not so well paid). A shop teller (assistant) probably closer to the lower limits. But Switzerland is an expensive country and our prices / salaries and cost of living are very disproportionate compared to USA.

[Echidna]

It's not that big, but it looks like it'd take quite a few grand to renovate.

[Pascal21M]

Or we can buy only a ground area where we put a indoor pool on it

[MerEmma]

That pool you linked though, the upkeep is what's killer. There's a nearby pool that's a little bit smaller than that and costs for the chlorine/water upkeep and the like is a good $10,000+ a month. I don't recall the exact numbers, but it's pricey as hell. I'd ask around your area at nearby pools what their overhead is.

[Echidna]

I think you put a few too many nulls on there.
Unless a pool is built in a fashion that spells economical and energetical desaster, the monthly upkeep for a smallish, but correctly built private pool is around 200-300€.

If a public pool is ten times as big (most are smaller than that, but let's just say 10 times for easier calculation), that'd mean an upkeep of around 2-3 grand per month.

To reach 10 thousand upkeep, you'd need at least 3 sizable pools in a complex.

Edit: unless you've already calculated in all costs of the buildings and facilities, and personnel wages as well.
In that case, the costs will indeed be close to 10000 or more, depending on the number of pools.

[Pascal21M]

Ok how much will cost a internet page for our project to present our project??

[Pascal21M]

How much users are here registered?
PS: We canask the professional mermaid if they will help us

[Echidna]

How much users are here registered?


Not sure what this has to do with your idea, unless you somehow plan to do this as an equivalent to the US "Mer Resort", and actually expect the members of MN to finance your project :p
I don't think this is feasible, mostly because no one will want to invest in something they'd have to travel to.

If you seriously wish to start this as a business, you should
1) work out a detailed plan of the facilities (how many pools, equipped with what extras, suited for whom)
2) evaluate the costs (work this out with architects, pool builders, and technicians)

and then present this project, preferably at the municipality where you want it to be.
If you market the idea right (an innovative, unique new fun water park with mermaids as attraction), they might decide to subsidize it.

I hope you're not imagining putting up a kickstarter on the web will be enough to get the funds for a project as expensive as that.

[Pascal21M]

Sure ill work this out but i hope somebody will help me doing that. I think the Chiemsee will be a nice place where the project can start cause its a touristical place.

[Yulia]

Sure ill work this out but i hope somebody will help me doing that.
I'm not trying to be rude, but you can't just assume that.

[Echinacea]

You will be better off to get your plans worked out first, like Caltuna said, so that when people ask 'how are you doing this?', you have something concrete and well-thought out to show them. Otherwise, most folks are going to say 'Nice dream, good luck with it!', rather than offering to help. It is YOUR crazy idea, so take the responsibility for it and get your research and planning done, then people may say it is not a crazy idea at all!! Good luck!

[Merman Arion]

You will be better off to get your plans worked out first, like Caltuna said, so that when people ask 'how are you doing this?', you have something concrete and well-thought out to show them. Otherwise, most folks are going to say 'Nice dream, good luck with it!', rather than offering to help. It is YOUR crazy idea, so take the responsibility for it and get your research and planning done, then people may say it is not a crazy idea at all!! Good luck!

Thank you Echi because those words were exactly my thoughts.
Not my intention to be rude but i have been baffled with this thread since the beginning and not at all convinced.


I'm not trying to be rude, but you can't just assume that.

I agree with Yulia. Never say that again when you present a business plan, it's a desperate move.

[Echidna]

Not my intention to be rude but i have been baffled with this thread since the beginning and not at all convinced.


Yea, actually from the beginning, I wasn't sure whether this is a troll thread, but I wanted to give the OP the benefit of doubt :p

At any rate, it's up to him to make a plan and get it all worked out.
If someone else did that, it'd be their idea and plan and not his...

[Mermaid Momo]

You will be better off to get your plans worked out first, like Caltuna said, so that when people ask 'how are you doing this?', you have something concrete and well-thought out to show them. Otherwise, most folks are going to say 'Nice dream, good luck with it!', rather than offering to help. It is YOUR crazy idea, so take the responsibility for it and get your research and planning done, then people may say it is not a crazy idea at all!! Good luck!

↑this. It isn't our job to collect all the information and do all the research for you. That your job, you should be selling the idea to US. I get you wanting a partner in this, but maybe you need to find someone near by who shares the same dream to help you out. Do some googling around, compare prices and multiple business plans.


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[Pascal21M]

I know it isnt your job. But i wanna find somebody who have the same idea and help me. I have not all experience for that thats the second point why i need help

[Pascal21M]

Ok ill make a plan