I want a Ciotka Kena Doll with LONG HAIR

[Mermaid Oshun]

Ciotka Kena means Ken's aunt in Polish. And here she is
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I think it is supposed to be like a plus sized Barbie doll.
I LOVE THIS DOLL and want to buy one. She looks like me except her hips are square instead of hourglass. (I wish she didnt have the spare tire thing going on and had long hair) I can find articles about it everywhere online but can't find them for sale. I just want it with long hair like a regular Barbie doll. I would like to have one so I could file those lumps off the top of her hips and give her long hair some how.


I have seen another plus sized Barbie but I do not care for this one. She has too many chins IMO...overkill. The rail skinny one is another extreme. For me the Ciotka Kena is one I'd like to add to my collection.
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What do you guys think of Ciotka Kena and Plus sized Barbie?

[Azurin Luna]

I think the Ciotka Kena looks nice, but indeed the hips look a bit weird on the doll. I do not like the Plus sized Barbie, she looks to over done

[Echidna]

I had no idea those dolls existed lol.
The Ciotka looks fine, apart from that weird lump (supposed to be belly fat maybe?).
It looks incongruous, because the doll actually has a really fine figure.

She's slender, opposed to the normal barbie, which would be an inch short of dying of anorexia/starvation.
Trying to sell slender figures as "plus-sized" (like real models who wear more than size zero) is a sick development,
which has led to young fashion models stepping off the runway, and toppling over dead (heart failure due to malnutrition).

The plus sized barbie up there however is the other extreme.
Look at both of them, you have to wonder where the middle ground is :p

[Mermaid Oshun]

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I wish they made the bigger Barbie more like the plus sized models for big girl stores. I would buy one of those too!
I dont know why they only sell the preanorexic sized doll. I like the plus sized human model's size and the ken's aunt a lot

[Mermaid Momo]

I think the people behind Barbie are just being big A**holes with this one. They were probably like "FINE YOU GUYS WANT A BIGGER BARBIE? HERE HAVE A BIGGER BARBIE. NOT WHAT YOU MEANT? TOO BAD. "
basically I think they're retaliating against all the people who wanted a bigger barbie doll by saying that plus size obviously means triple chins when it doesn't Plus size can mean any one with curves! I wish they actually went and made an actual curvy doll.

[Seatan]

I have never been too upset about Barbie's size... I mean, she is a cartoonish doll. Nobody gets upset because anime characters have huge eyes. She was never meant to realistically portray a person, anymore than gender less Ken represents the real bodies of men. That said, I do wish they had a truly curvy body, as in the picture above of the plus sized models. You can be curvy and our world's definition of "plus size" without adding in the belly roll, which looks TOO realistic--just from the size of the eyes you can tell these dolls are not meant to be hyper realistic, so when they made heavier shapes that way the. It comes off like they are trying to go to an extreme. Heck, the only reason real Barbie isn't what we nowadays call "plus size" is because she had mile long legs. If she had short legs then her huge boobs and baby bearing hips would put her firmly in that category. Because, obviously, real women should look like 16 year old boys. *rolls eyes*. Personally I love some meat on a woman--hello, that's what makes us women! It would be nice to see some dolls that portray that in an attractive way.

[deepblue]

As a lover of vintage lingerie, the thing I find odd about the Ken's Aunt doll is that she's wearing a foundation garment intended to smooth out the area there... it makes it look like her undies are way too tight. But she's cool looking otherwise, because she looks based on realistic measurements, and that's kind of nifty.

ETA- apparently there are modern foundation garments like that still. lol I just don't tend to venture into modern lingerie shops. :p

The plus size Barbie... the pic of the actual plus sized model is aperfect example of why that is just... what? But like Seavanna said, Barbie's never been meant to be realistic. Even if not based on a model, I can think of several friends with the body of that plus sized doll who do not have three chins. A larger body doesn't necessarily mean they have a lot of extra weight on their face.

[Mermaid Dottie]

http://www.judgmentofparis.com/board/showthread.php?t=1920

Apparently, There were only 24 of these Ciotka Kena dolls ever made.
I wish I could get my hands on one. I'd take her apart, to make molds of her and reproduce her for my children to play with.

[deepblue]

Holy mackerel, they must be in private collections. This explains why there is not even one on eBay.

[Seatan]

The plus size Barbie... the pic of the actual plus sized model is aperfect example of why that is just... what? But like Seavanna said, Barbie's never been meant to be realistic. Even if not based on a model, I can think of several friends with the body of that plus sized doll who do not have three chins. A larger body doesn't necessarily mean they have a lot of extra weight on their face.

indeed. I know several very attractive women of that size and NONE of them have three chins. I even had one girl at my last high school who was beyond any kind of size you could call "curvy" and was simply obese--there were no clothes that fit her, she had to lift up her stomach to get into a desk and still barely fit, etc--and she had a beautiful face, no extra chins to be seen, yet the poor thing will probably not live to see forty if someone doesn't help her get her weight under control. The extra chin thing DOES make it seem like they were trying to be aholes.

[Seatan]

Who would YOU rather have in YOUR bed?

THIS

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OR THIS?

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I know MY answer, and it ain't the chopsticks. *drools over Christina Hendricks*

[deepblue]

Actually, I've dated women with both body types. Both were real women, both were naturally their size. I was happy to have both in my bed. So, that said, I hope this thread won't degenerate into another 'this body type is a real woman' because it isn't fair to anyone, it leaves people hurt, and solves nothing.

All women are real women, and none of us are only our bodies.

eta- just in case it does, such things really bug me based on several reasons, so I'll just take leave of this thread now. :)

[SeaSister]

Because, obviously, real women should look like 16 year old boys. *rolls eyes*. Personally I love some meat on a woman--hello, that's what makes us women!

I'm sorry, but I have to disagree with you there. I loathe the term "real women", which is usually followed by "...have curves", or something similar. Honestly, if you have a vagina, you are a "real woman". 'Nough said. Weight doesn't have anything to do with it. Some are born lean and skinny and find it difficult to gain weight at all (ectomorph). Some find it really easy to gain fat (endomorph), while others gain muscle easily (mesomorph). But body type does NOT indicate gender, that's just silly. To say that women should look a certain way, be it curvy or skinny, instills a negative ideal that, no matter what, excludes other female body types. And that's not really fair.

Now, I know, I know. There are PLENTY of girls who reach the extreme ends of the spectrum, the obese and the super-skinny. I'm not trying to endorse the choices of these particular types, because honestly I do think that women need to take care of themselves, whether it means eating/exercising more or eating/exercising less. Obesity in particular is a huge problem in America (and, I'm sad to say, an increasingly large issue in Canada as well) and I strongly believe that telling morbidly obese people that "it's okay, be proud of yourself!" is in no way going to help them. Nor do I believe that it's conducive to treat anorexics as ideal role models, as we so often do in society. Neither situation is a healthy one.

Anyways, my point is that a woman is a woman, no matter what the scale says. To say that a "real woman" fits into a specific category (curvy, lean, fat, skinny, etc.) is an insult to all other women. And it's hurtful, even if it's not meant to be. As long as you are healthy, comfortable in your own skin and have a set of ovaries (except for maybe in a few exceptional circumstances, but I'm not going to go there), you are a REAL woman. No other prerequisites apply.

ETA - I might have to follow deepblue's example and step away from this, heh. My scales are already bristling a bit. But anyways, that's my two cents.

[Seatan]

Okay people when I said "because obviously real women should look like 16 year old boys" I was referencing the anorexic Barbie doll/too skinny to live/reason so many people have body issues, NOT what "real women" should look like if you read the dang post. Maybe I'm just in a pissy mood tonight, but one thing I hate about the Internet is when people take offense at evey little thing, especially when the entire thread has been about giving girls a better body image. I think everybody here freaking knows that I was referring to the way that our culture sets impossible body standards that affect 99% of women at some point in their lives, and if you are taking it any other way then you need to calm down and realize I was trying to support giving teenaged girls a good vision of women, not dissing skinny women. Also I am allowed to say that I like curvy women AND to say that we are supposed to have some fat. It is a biological truth. Go look it up. Women are fattier in the thighs and buttocks so that when we are pregnant there is reserve fat for the child if we go hungry. So I am sorry, but I do not like bring targeted as a bad guy for saying the truth. I never said that no women are naturally skinny or that there was anything wrong with heheh skinny! The whole point of my post was in regard to the thing about having a doll with realistic proportions! And yeah, I like my women to have breasts. I am allowed to freaking like that. So excuse me for being in a shitty mood tonight, but most women have have serious problems with body issues, including me, and I really take offense to the implication I was somehow insulting skinny women by saying thet real women (by that i mean NOT BARBIE since as you can see this thread is about DOLLS) are not so thin they would DIE if they were real (like Barbie). I get SO tired of how on the Internet people take everything you say and somehow turn it into something bad!

[Seatan]

Seriously I get SO tired of people taking things you say and turning it into something to lecture on!

[Seatan]

So please go ahead and step away after turning an innocent comment meant in NO way derogatory toward ANYONE into some major thing. You want to talk bristling? I am bristling for having my words twisted!

[Prince Calypso]

And this is why i feel like shit for being tiny

[Mermaid Oshun]

You have no reason to feel bad about any of this Prince. We are discussing body image of those of us with vaginas (women) Guys are generally much leaner as a rule and this isn't about that.
Glad everyone realized that Seavanna was not attacking any ladies by stating her preference. I really would like to find some realistic curvy dolls to add to my collection though. If anyone spots any please post them.

[Prince Calypso]

I base my body on a feminine scale so yeah i do feel a bit bad cause i wish i could be a little bit more heavy and put on weight.
I come from a family of black woman and most if not all are big beautiful ladies curves in all the right place. growing up around this i can understand how annoying it is to have a standardized level of beauty be perceived as being slimmer and smaller by the american populous.

[Prince Calypso]

Okay people when I said "because obviously real women should look like 16 year old boys" I was referencing the anorexic Barbie doll/too skinny to live/reason so many people have body issues, NOT what "real women" should look like if you read the dang post. Maybe I'm just in a pissy mood tonight, but one thing I hate about the Internet is when people take offense at evey little thing, especially when the entire thread has been about giving girls a better body image. I think everybody here freaking knows that I was referring to the way that our culture sets impossible body standards that affect 99% of women at some point in their lives, and if you are taking it any other way then you need to calm down and realize I was trying to support giving teenaged girls a good vision of women, not dissing skinny women. Also I am allowed to say that I like curvy women AND to say that we are supposed to have some fat. It is a biological truth. Go look it up. Women are fattier in the thighs and buttocks so that when we are pregnant there is reserve fat for the child if we go hungry. So I am sorry, but I do not like bring targeted as a bad guy for saying the truth. I never said that no women are naturally skinny or that there was anything wrong with heheh skinny! The whole point of my post was in regard to the thing about having a doll with realistic proportions! And yeah, I like my women to have breasts. I am allowed to freaking like that. So excuse me for being in a shitty mood tonight, but most women have have serious problems with body issues, including me, and I really take offense to the implication I was somehow insulting skinny women by saying thet real women (by that i mean NOT BARBIE since as you can see this thread is about DOLLS) are not so thin they would DIE if they were real (like Barbie). I get SO tired of how on the Internet people take everything you say and somehow turn it into something bad!

I don't think anyone was stating that you were personally attack anyone, they were just giving their views on just as you had done. yes you did come off a bit pointed and defensive in your bluntness but that's fine. no harm no foul. but getting upset cause someone voiced their feeling on the matter really isn't fair. I'm saying you were in the wrong or anything like that's just everyone has a right to their opinion even it opposes someone else

[Merman Arion]

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As much as i am on Seavanna's side on this one, it's a matter concerning women so i will stay out of this.

@Calypso : Dont feel bad for being tiny and in shape. You shouldn't feel threatened by these standards. Just be yourself no matter what.

[Seatan]

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Yes it did. I shouldn't post when I am tired and not feeling well. I apologize to anyone I got upset with.

[Mermaid Oshun]

http://www.nytimes.com/1991/08/21/obituaries/jack-ryan-dies-at-65-designer-of-barbie-doll.html
Yep I should have figured. Barbie was designed by a man. (Jack Ryan) Since they are coming up with a prototype for a new full figure Barbie I really suggest they look at Ashley Stewart and plus size models. Plus size can be beautiful without being a negative caricature.
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[PearlieMae]

Yep I should have figured. Barbie was designed by a man.

As if there were ever any doubt.

[Mermaid Momo]

So please go ahead and step away after turning an innocent comment meant in NO way derogatory toward ANYONE into some major thing. You want to talk bristling? I am bristling for having my words twisted!
I don't think anyone is really twisting your words. They're responding in a polite way to what you said. No one twisted anything afterall, different people read things and hear things differently. I'm glad that they addressed body positivity (sp?) for all sizes because I also felt that some posts in this thread was saying what a "real woman" was like and that she wasn't a small girl but a curvy girl with lots of meat on her bones. Yes, it may not have been what you meant, but it is how some people will read it. and Like Calypso, I started to feel a bit bad about my body size since I am on the small side (and sometimes even called anorexic because you can see my rib cage when I move even though I'm a healthy 118 lbs for my height and age.) So it's not that they're jumping down your throat, they're voicing their opinions in the same way you were and there is no crime in that.
( and I'm not going to lie, My scales started to bristle a bit too since I felt like you were not only saying that you prefered a curvy woman, that is ok. But that you were saying that a small woman, a woman like me; isn't a real woman, and that I look like a boy)
I do like this thread, honestly it's a nice topic that I was hoping someone besides tumblr and my fb friends would talk about (the barbie, since my friends on fb and the people I follow on tumblr are all feminist, I felt I needed an outside view on the doll) but I do think that with some opinions that were voiced (mostly the way they were done) makes some people feel singled out.

[Mermaid Cascada]

I agree with draggersprez. But I also wish that they'd make dolls off all sizes (because there are so many body types). And I think if someone really wanted to, they could write to the companies who make popular dolls and make a request for dolls that have different body types (to support women of all sizes). I've seen dolls in the store that have no hair to support children that have hair loss due to sickness and other causes, so there's a good chance they'd make some if they got enough requests.

But overall, I believe all body types are beautiful(as long as you're healthy) and no one body type is better than the other.

[Echidna]

Agree with everything Draggersprez and Cascada were saying.

While anorexia is certainly not a beauty ideal that should be supported, there is no need to start "skinny-hate".
Skinny women are just as feminine as bigger ones, whether you prefer their body shape or not.

Some people can't gain weight, and others can't lose any.
But as long as you're healthy, all is well with your size.

[Mermaid Oshun]

I agree totally. here here!
The problem that this thread is addressing, however is that if the above is true and all healthy body shapes are beautiful, why can we ONLY buy skinny dolls???
Not everyone aspires to be that thin.Some admire sensuous, voluptuous curves, so why is one look that not everyone likes being forced upon us?

[Echidna]

The problem that this thread is addressing, however is that if the above is true and all healthy body shapes are beautiful, why can we ONLY buy skinny dolls???

The over-thinness seems to be a Barbie-specific feature though.
Other dolls have more normal shapes- think of She-Ra, Teela, all those are females with a healthy, athletic physique.

Barbie is not made to resemble an actual living person, but art draw figurines.
I'm not sure what the correct term is, but those are drawings which exaggerate the model to be ultra-tall and ultra-thin, very stylized and not at all realistic.

There are some other lines of similar dolls which are meatier and more realistic, but the label "Barbie" has its look as its trademark I guess.

[Mermaid Oshun]

Oh wow, I just looked at the She Ra and the Teela dolls.Thanks for the info on those ! :D Unfortunately I like those even LESS. :$
They both look like Arnold Schwarzenegger dolls with a womans clothes on.
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Look at those biceps and manly thighs! She does look just like a dude for God's sake. I bet they just took a GI Joe doll and put a woman's head on it for goodness sake. This is even sadder than I thought!
There is a real void here. We definitely need some voluptuous girl dolls on the market. No wonder women have such poor self esteem. There are no dolls on the market that look like the typical young girl. There are a lot of boy dolls that look like typical boys but none that look like most girls who are not waif skinny. They should take the guys off the design team that are currently doing things because imo theyve failed. From the looks of it these guys have never even seen women's bodies. I mean it's understandable considering a lot artist guys Ive met just aren't really into girls that way...much. So it's not their fault really.

They need new talent who can think about this differently imo.

[Echidna]

:jawdrop: Man, that's an ugly version of She-Ra!

I only know the old original doll versions, which looked very close to the concept art also known from cartoons and comics, examples
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no idea why the newer versions of the series look so manly. Probably so that boys would take an interest in them :p

But yea, there is a definite lack of a certain type of doll for sure.
I have to admit though I always was more into action figures.

I loved my Teela, which came with Snake Goddess trappings, and the Sorceress of course
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and all the snake people and non-humanoid guys of the series lol.

[Ponytales]

http://www.nytimes.com/1991/08/21/obituaries/jack-ryan-dies-at-65-designer-of-barbie-doll.html
Yep I should have figured. Barbie was designed by a man. (Jack Ryan) Since they are coming up with a prototype for a new full figure Barbie I really suggest they look at Ashley Stewart and plus size models. Plus size can be beautiful without being a negative caricature.
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Barbie is heavily based upon a doll called Bild Lili, found by Ruth Handler (one of the founders and owners of Mattel) and her daughter Barbera while on vacation in Germany, and then brought home and almost completely copied to make Barbie. Jack Ryan had not nearly as much to do with the design as he liked to claim, as there was almost nothing left to design at that point. Go ahead and google a side by side comparison of Bild Lili and Barbie.

I'd like to add that their shape was based on the heavily girdled/almost corset like figure that was in vogue in the 50s. There was, for a short time, a realistically figured and athletically fit Barbie circa 2002 or so. She wasn't quite curvy, and was certainly an idealized body, but basically looked like a healthy and active woman with wide hips and an average, modest set of C cups. They've since slimmed her down heavily and played up the hip/waist/bust ratio.

Both of the dolls in the original post are meant as art pieces. The Kens Aunt doll is the work of an artist, hence its short run of dolls (I'm not 100% sure but I think its the same person responsible for that "Shave the Baby" thing) and the "Fat Barbie" is total Photoshoppery, hence the Worth1000 logo at the bottom.

...Sorry, I'm a Barbie collector and this stuff really bugs me.

[Mermaid Tula]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NUDE-Happy-Family-Midge-Mom-Grandparent-Grandma-Old-lady-woman-Barbie-Doll-BD-21-/151200788686?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item233444f0ce

My daughter has this doll. She's supposed to be Barbie's Grandmother Midge. Compared to your standard barbie, she has a thicker waist and a bit of a belly.

[Echidna]

I dug up this thread, because yahoo had again the image of the fan-made "realistic barbie":

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probably not for sale yet, but the model does exist.

[Mermaid Momo]

I dug up this thread, because yahoo had again the image of the fan-made "realistic barbie":

19196

probably not for sale yet, but the model does exist.
This doll is actually an artist's project if I remember correctly. So I don't think they will ever be for sale .

[Mermaid Isabel(:]

Actually someone has designed a doll like this and is wanting to sell it. I saw it on the news about a week ago I can't really remember the details.

[LittleTreasure]

Hey guys...I didn't read through this completely so sorry if I'm repeating someone's answer, but I'm pretty sure the bigger Barbie doll with all those chins is a Photoshopped fake meant to insult heavier women... Just saying. I wonder if that Ken's Aunt doll is real? I have never seen one before.

[Mermaid Annariea]

actually, the picture of the doll that caltuna posted is trying to get made.
the guy who designed it took the average dimensions of a 19-year-old girl and made a computer rendering of a doll. he got so much positive feedback that he hopes to make it a real doll.
http://www.care2.com/causes/move-over-barbie-make-way-for-lammily-the-worlds-first-average-sized-doll.html