tank owners!!

[SteampunkMermaid]

I'm currently commissioning a tank (which is a little hush hush on design until it's finished) but I've been asking questions and poking around. So tank owners, I'd like to ask:

How do you fill your tanks?
How do you empty your tanks?
What's the best way to get tank water to a septic unit?
Any other tips you would like to leave?

I've been looking at the Utah water laws (Rocky mountain pod ;) ) so I know most of the appropriate ways for eliminating waterwaste, I just don't know how to get it tothe units or if their are other places I can get rid of it. Transportation of a full tank is ...Pretty much a no no where I'm at since it has no secure cover.

[Morticia Mermaid]

From experience with setting up a full size pool at an event, you want either a water pump (like to pump water out of a boat) or a drain spout either on the bottom of the tank or on the lower edge of a side wall. When we filled the pool, it took forever. We were filling it with on site water, but it was split probably 6+ ways to other encampments. There are some areas where you can actually order a certain amount of water via water tanker.

Tip for both safety reasons and ease of transport- mount it on the back of a trailer with jack stands for stability and leveling. It will make it not only easier to transport and set up, but it will be a lot safer because you wont have to move the tank around just the trailer.

[BayouMermaid]

Haha, I got excited for a minute because I thought this thread was for people who owned aquariums (like with fish). Guess I'll just save my fish tank pictures for another day....

[AniaR]

A lot of those questions depend on where youre booked and local permits. *getting a tank in July*

[AniaR]

also, feel free to introduce yourself ;)

[Thalassa]

Is this Nym?

[Fifi Tigg]

A lot of those questions depend on where youre booked and local permits. *getting a tank in July*
Congrats Raina! I would love to get a tank to not only entertain the kids but keep the buzz going for Busselton Mermaids :D

[AniaR]

Yes we're lucky in Canada we can apply for funding for both our business and performing. it's been a good 6 months of writing grant applications, and looks like a big chunk coming in in july. So we've been in contact with a well reputable tank company and got a quote I'll be sure to start a thread when it gets here ;) I wouldnt expect to see anything from us til closer to the end of the year between construction time, shipping it here, and us getting it established. It is not something I would have ever considered just doing. It's taken years of research and contacting people. And it's going to be a huge undertaking.

[Morticia Mermaid]

Congrats Raina. Do you guys know how you're going to transport, store, fill, etc?

The guy I've been working with find a way to bulls a lid for ours that will lock and seal closed for transport. That way we aren't having to fill it, then empty it, and so on. It's going to be mounted to a trailer with removable walls. My uncle is a certified titanium welder (only 160 in the us), he's constructing the walls and reinforcing the trailer :)

Sent by star fish

[AniaR]

yup but I'm not sharing til we physically get to test it all out. Too many people jump on tanks without any education or safety or testing, and it's already resulted in a mermaid having their tank break while they were in it. I've already seen on the forum how people jump over things before the person has even had a result. I have 3 different plans based on our research and conversations with the company and other specialist, so I'll post it all when I know it all works ;)

[AniaR]

though I'm curious how you plan to be able to pull yours filled. Raven's tank weighs something crazy empty and they barely manage to pull it with a huge truck and trailer. I certainly have no interested in having water in our all the time after everything I've researched. too dangerous. plus no way our car could pull all that

[Morticia Mermaid]

Agreed. People get into too much of a rush to have one and don't stop to think. Been working on plans since start of last fall when my cook introduced me to his friend. People would seriously be surprised about what all goes into the planning and details of making and having a tank

Sent by star fish

[Winged Mermaid]

Raven's tank is 1700lbs empty and nearly 5 tons full. A regular truck can't tow a full tank, it simply can't handle that much weight. You'd need a Class 3 truck (pickup trucks only stretch classes 1 and 2) to be able to pull that much weight. For most states you'd need a special license to drive a class 3 truck as well.

You're going to need a certian kind of truck just to be able to handle the weight of the empty tank and trailer. Most half-ton truks are only rated for 2000lbs (1 ton) of weight (you also have to keep in mind the weight of the trailer as well as the tank). Also most states mandate trailers more than 1,500 pounds be equipped with separate brake systems that can be integrated with the truck, otherwise there can be serious safety issues. So tack that on to the cost of a tank as well.

[Morticia Mermaid]

Already have :) member of my crew has a CDL and a truck more than capable of hauling it, and is more than willing to contribute time and such to the crew for eventing.

Some of this stuff people just don't think about. I've been working with a professional tank designer since the start of last fall. We've discussed all the minor and major details from construction to transportation to storage and even the best way to clean it, as well as recommended cleaning filtration systems to clean the water when is not in use.

Sent by star fish

[Morticia Mermaid]

Wow, migraine must have really been kicking in earlier. Brain didn't even comprehend the first part if Raina's post. anyways, answered in my last post. Sorry Raina

Sent by star fish

[Thalassa]

Well, if the OP is who I think it is, the tank is something my group is doing. If not, I apologize, OP.

Anyway, we are NOT planning on transporting a full tank. She said that transporting a full tank is a no no, she's mostly asking about water rights and how y'all get your tanks filled (do you find the water or does your client, etc).

I'd like to say that our process is still being tested, most of us are on edge about the safety. As far as research, what research would you say constitutes enough? Or in other words: can you point me in the right direction so I can educate myself better?

OP, if it's not our tank I apologize. Your user and area remind me of my friend. :-)

[Thalassa]

And when I say the process is being tested, the tank is still in the planning stages. ;-)

[AniaR]

Yeah that question was to Morticia not o.p

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[Thalassa]

Oh. :-) Good stuff!

[SteampunkMermaid]

Yes, it's me . nym :)
Congratulations raina!! Tanks are exciting and we sirens are really stoked for our tank.

[SteampunkMermaid]

And Raina and Morticia, the Tank will be permanently mounted on a trailer that will indeed be lifted by jack supports. Thank you guys so much for your feedback, I'll introduce myself in the other forums and find a way to get a few photos up.

[Thalassa]

Um, quick question: Who had their tank break? What happened? Are they okay?

[Winged Mermaid]

I know Blue Mermaid's tank broke. She posted about it on the forum somewhere.. Thankfully no one was hurt. Tanks can be very dangerous though. I cringe when I see people buy glass tanks, or make home made stands for tanks. If you don't do the math right, someone can end up seriously hurt or worse, and so many people are willing to cut corners to get a tank.. just very concerning :/

[Echidna]

You can see a tank cracking in the Hollywood movie "Million Dollar Mermaid".

If a tank bottoms out, it would even be worse and most likely deadly for whoever happened to be inside.

[Winged Mermaid]

Exactly.

[AniaR]

A tanked cracked at disney

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[Mermaid Wesley]

Yikes! Okay so maybe I'll just live with a portable pool. The kind with the inflatable ring. And I've seen one with a window on this site before, but it wasn't available to buy. I bet I could figure a way to put a window in the side of one of those pools. Hmmmmm


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[Morticia Mermaid]

I know everyone is concerned about safety, but we all need to remember that everyone can own a tank if they wanted. Perhaps one of us who is working with a professional could steer them in a safer path of doing it by writing up an informational thread on tanks? Maybe one that contains information on recommended window thickness, size, best materials, safety issues, etc.

I just think that way we aren't making anyone think that only an elite (poor word I know, but I can't think of another term for it as my head is still pounding) few can have a tank.

[Winged Mermaid]

I just think that way we aren't making anyone think that only an elite (poor word I know, but I can't think of another term for it as my head is still pounding) few can have a tank.

No one ever said that, I'm confused as to where you got that from? We're all just concerned for safety. I'm just trying to stress that you can NOT cut corners with this stuff, as you could be taking your life and others into your hands when you do that. And a lot of mers seem willing to cut corners to get tanks, which as I said is distressing. Heck Million Dollar mermaid was for a production and done by processionals, and they ended up with a cracking tank. Disney probably has the top in the business build their tanks, and they had one break. With tanks a lot can go wrong, every person who has a large aquarium knows that. We're taking those and making them mobile and putting people in them, so that's a lot more that can go wrong and potential safety hazards. People tend to overlook that fact when they get excited about the possibility of a tank, so that's why we stress the safety issues. In this case, safety can mean lots of money. That doesn't mean that people can't have it, it just means they need to commit to the investment. Every mer could own one if they got a loan big enough ;)

Also, there's SO much involved in making a safe tank, you can't just do a write up about it willy nilly. There's a lot too account for, like the weight and pressure of the water in and outside of the tank. I'm sure there's a lot of detailed stuff about the thickness of the acrylic, what screws are required, and all kinds of other stuff like that. Someone who knows their stuff would need to write that, and no one I've seen on here knows that info. Most tank builders aren't willing to just put their trade (sometimes trade secret) info up for grabs either.

You're working with a people who are constructing your tank, maybe you could ask them detailed questions and do a write up :)

[Morticia Mermaid]

:) I didn't say anyone said it Iona. If you read it, I said "we aren't making anyone THINK". I got it from taking a standpoint as someone new to the forum who might be looking into getting into performing. Reading this thread in that standpoint, someone might THINK or FEEL that only a select few can have a tank.

Believe me, I know just how much goes into plans for a tank. Like I said, I've been working on plans sine last fall and we STILL aren't quite ready for construction. And I thinks its because of the fact that so many are willing to cut corners is the reason WHY I think we need to do a general write up for everyone looking to get a tank :) That way people have a place they can look for information, or ask questions and those working with professionals can answer. Which again, is why I suggested someone working with a professional write it up. So that it's not being written up just "willy nilly".

[AniaR]

people cut corners constantly in this community. Going for the bad materials to make monofins and having them shatter, making tails out of toxic materials, and building tanks and having them break. Swimming in the ocean for photos without safety people etc. I think if anything our community has proven that a lot of people jump first think later. So I think the concern around tanks is warranted. That being said, I'll type up info after I actually have the thing in my possession ;)

[Thalassa]

Umm...what does "bottoms out" mean (as in when a tank bottoms out)? Sorry, I'm not a technical language type person. :-S

[AniaR]

literally the bottom comes out and water goes everywhere.

http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Mission-Impossible_-Aquarium-Scene_616.jpg
^movie joke

http://reefbuilders.com/files/2010/02/aquarium-leak-dubai-mall.jpg
^professionally made

http://i.ytimg.com/vi/gIzKtE6xSr8/0.jpg

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/12/26/article-2253406-16A94553000005DC-409_634x411.jpg

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2014/03/18/article-2583477-1C629C0E00000578-42_964x911.jpg
^Disney

http://i1.cdnds.net/12/51/618x379/odd-burst-shark-tank-2.jpg

http://i.ytimg.com/vi/8wisQaKx_Q0/0.jpg

[BayouMermaid]

One of my customers builds large tanks (1,000+ gallons), though I doubt they would be portable. His are glass fronted with wood sides and supports. Really cool to look at!

[Fun123joker]

http://i.ytimg.com/vi/8wisQaKx_Q0/0.jpg

wait that really happened?! i saw the picture everywhere i just thought it was a flood with sharks photoshopped in them!

ok but let think, how would one break a tank?

[Mermaid Wesley]

the pic with the escalators and the sharks was photoshop but the tank did burst

[Fun123joker]

kk cool but where did those sharks go? just not the escalators but where

[AniaR]

That pic is real the escalator one isn't.

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[Echidna]

the chinese mall one was very upsetting.
the fish probably all died :(

when I read the news and all they ever mentioned was the people, I was like "SAVE THE FISH INSTEAD"

[AniaR]

At least at Disney everyone helped save the fish

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[BlueMermaid]

Yeah that was an acrylic tank I bought on craigslist. No one was ever in the tank with water in it. We tested it and water started spewing from the seams. My husband attempted to fix that and our second test was successful. Unfortunately our 3rd test, filling it for an event, was not! Water again started coming out the seams and the acrylic cracked in one spot.

Do not get excited about a tank and forget your senses like I did. No one was hurt, but I lost alot of money. :(


I know Blue Mermaid's tank broke. She posted about it on the forum somewhere.. Thankfully no one was hurt. Tanks can be very dangerous though. I cringe when I see people buy glass tanks, or make home made stands for tanks. If you don't do the math right, someone can end up seriously hurt or worse, and so many people are willing to cut corners to get a tank.. just very concerning :/

[Aziara]

Out of curiosity, where does one even buy 2" or thicker plexiglass and acrylic? I know lowes or home depot certainly don't seem to have it.

[BayouMermaid]

My customer who builds tanks special orders it through glass shops. That's also how he was able to get 12 foot panels. No idea what the cost is though.

[Thalassa]

May I ask how you did your seams so we know what to avoid?

[Aziara]

I know it's not real, but I wish it was..... http://files.sharenator.com/fish_tank_truck-s460x319-71233.jpg

[Aziara]

Ok! An idea just came to me! I was daydreaming about the picture in the last post I just made, and I had a thought-- There are trucks made to haul full water tanks! http://www.dfiequipment.com/pages/view/38 The tank is 14’ Long X 5‘Tall X 8’ Wide, and it holds a whopping 4000 gallons. Of course, alterations to make a clear side and a top hatch to get in would be necessary. And I'm pretty sure I'll never afford it, lol. But hey, I can dream!http://www.dfiequipment.com/images/wtu/3513089.jpg

[Echidna]

I don't think it could be alterated (is that a word?), it would have to be built as a tank truck from the beginning.
Just like the first photo, which is basically a truck with an aquarium on top? ;)

[Winged Mermaid]

Even if you get a tank built onto a trailer it still needs massive support, just FYI. Hence the metal frame and bars for the one I swam in at Paradiso (about 40x6x4).

20090
(source (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=500436543359816&set=a.628366470566822&type=3&theater))

You can see by this pic that it has metal not only on the outside, but on the inside as well with tons of bolts along each support bar. That metal was THICK.

20091
(source (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=500436543359816&set=a.628366470566822&type=3&theater))

[Mermaid Lorelei]

Gah, do you have any idea how much a tank like Moon's costs, Iona?

[MerEmma]

I'm no expert but that HAS to be like $70k+ if Raven's was the price of a used (or new? can't recall) car.

[AniaR]

I believe she rented it from a group that specializes in that stuff.

[Winged Mermaid]

Moon doesn't like to discuss stuff like that so I don't know. Ridiculous amounts probably :P I know she got it used after years scouring for one.. she did so much work to get her hands on it! She contacted tons of people herself rather than waiting for one to pop up.

[Thalassa]

So, Iona, I saw that in your video you said swimming in a tank was a lot different from swimming in a pool. What unexpected difference(s) were there? What differences did you anticipate correctly?

[Winged Mermaid]

I answered this question on my Instagram so I'm just going to copy and paste the response since it's huge. I'm talking about more that particular tank since that's all I've performed in, but maybe you'll find some useful info :)

Good question! (Warning, wall-o-text) Generally, freaking awesome and amazing and a dream come true!!! It was so so amazing to have LOADS of room to swim, and flip, and turn, and frolic! But there are a few things you have to be aware of for sure. You have to be very aware of where you are in the tank at all times, as the walls are clear. You can get turned around easy and end up playing to the wrong side of the tank :P I did that twice when I did a flip and got turned around, but luckily I was able to tell a few seconds after. Also the ends.. one of the mermaids swam right into the end and hit her head really hard! Luckily she didn't have a concussion, but we checked with medical and she opted to stay in the medical tent for a few hours after and take the rest of the night off from the tank to be sure. She also described being in the tank with clear walls as a "claustrophobic" feeling, but I didn't have an issue with that myself.

You have to be very aware of your fluke so it doesn't get caught on the acrylic, since silicone is sticky and will stick onto it. Also even though the tank is a small area to move a large fluke around in you have to try and move it constantly, even when taking a second to catch your breath to 1) maintain the natural mermaid look, rather thank looking like a girl in a tail as the crowd can always see you and 2) keep warm (the tank was very cold). With the several inches of distorting acrylic, the lights, and murkey hose water, as another mermaid said, "you can't see your hand in front of your face"- so telling what the crowd is doing is very hard. You generally see vague blurs and a little more if they're close to the glass. I as quite proud of myself for being able to put my hand to someone else's hand and kiss the walls to return a kiss from a crowd member several times, a few on my first go in the tank! You also have to be aware of where the support bars are on that particular tank- you don't want to do bubble rings or some other trick and be obscured or blocked by the support beam if at all possible. Sometimes the floating/drifting factor makes that hard, so you just have to judge the best you can.

We also had to put on and take off our tails at the top of the tank, since the platform leading up there was very steep and slippery stairs (we put textured neon tape on it to help with the slip factor but it didn't help much). We had a handler up there at all times to help us in and out and help in case of any emergencies. With my heavy tail and a foot and a half between the waterline and platform I had to be pulled up out of the water by the handler. I am extremely thankful for how efficient our handlers were! They even carried the tails to the top and back down from the platform for us for our safety. I really liked being able to put my hand on the glass or the bolts that were on the inside of the support beams to help me stay under or move around while submerged. The general sight and sensation and just working with the glass to enhance your performance is just awesome! I know that's the main thing that everyone wants to know about, but it's hard to describe! It's just super fun to play with :) I was in there for 20+ minutes every time according to the handler. According to him that was longer than the the others. Each time I got out it was becuase I was forced to by my body. The first was becuase I couldn't hold my left eye open consistently any longer because of grit in the tank (I used my eye ointment to help with that before I went in the tank after that first go) and was clamoring for the eye rinse after I got out- I think I used like half the bottle flushing my eyes. Second time was bad cramps in the front of both of my calves- the handler had to haul me out because I couldn't help him, and I just sat there for 15 minutes after in so much pain I couldn't get up, and they hurt for hours after. Which I stretched and took more cal-mag and motrin to help with. Third was very bad shivering from the cold- luckily our green tent had a space heater and one of the other mermaids piled towels on top of me until i stopped shivering :)

It was definitely a huge learning experience, and was just beyond amazing. I was able to get in there more times than the other mermaids, which made me very happy! ^_^ The last time no one in terms of audience was in the cove, and all the mermaids seemed done for the night, but I said put me back in the tank, I'll swim! Lets shut this festival down! There are defiantly some tricks that I figured out worked well with being in that tank in the last swim that I wish I had figured out earlier to use them more. I'm hoping with all of my heart that I will be returning next year! Dream come true!

[SteampunkMermaid]

Thank you so much for the useful information miss winged mermaid. I appreciate the copy post. <3