individual scales

[Odette]

So I am finally starting to see others make tails with individual scales. Iv'e always made my tails this way from fabric to silicone since 2009. I feel really excited that some other talented mers are also starting to do this. It's about time. lol. So who has made and wore theirs? Who is working on one? I have been gone from this forum for so long that I don't know what's been going on. Keep me updated. I really can't wait to see how well everyone likes theirs!

I gotta say my favorite part about my tails is that the scales retract into each other instead of bunching up in rolls like fabric does and I always felt that they look nicer and more realistic too. I have done rows and individual ones. It takes a lot longer, but I love it.

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I have two more in the works, but i'm not ready to show them yet. This one I made last year, but it still needs work.
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[Mermaid Wesley]

I'm making mine this way right now :) I'm just trying to get the gosh darn resin to cure for my molds :/


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[Odette]

I just heard about this resin mold thing. I personally hate resin. Mixing the parts is so important and you really have to mix for a solid 10 minutes. What kind of resin? Epoxy?

[Seatan]

I am making one this way as well. Your tails are gorgeous, by the way! How did you attach the scales to the tail itself? (Just wondering if your method is similar to the one Pearlie used.) I know that FinFolk has just started offering a "realistic tail" upgrade where they attach the scales one by one... Perhaps it is the way of the future! I just love that I have total control over the look and placement of every scale... not that I am a control freak or anything. :biting nails:

Wesley, the Plastalina clay seems to be working with the Colormatch resin. The mold I first cast with it tonight just felt rough because it was of a real seashell that had a rough texture. :doh: I think it is going to work out! If you have a craft store nearby you, you can pick some up for real cheap (though I don't know how much you've already done in Monstermakers. I had only made about six scales.)

[Seatan]

I just heard about this resin mold thing. I personally hate resin. Mixing the parts is so important and you really have to mix for a solid 10 minutes. What kind of resin? Epoxy?

Smooth On's Smooth-Cast Colormatch resin. It's actually really easy to mix (1:1 ratio) and you don't have to stir it for more than thirty seconds or so. Then you just pour it in and wait. No smell, no mess, and it's clear. The only downside--it doesn't like oily clays that get really soft with heat. (AKA Monstermaker). It bubbles up like CRAZY leaving you with a coral like texture, sort of like volcanic rock. What did you use? Silicone? Shell shock?

[OceanRose]

I've been advised to use epoxy, not polyester. I talked to a resin guy yesterday and he said do a thin coat of resin first (and let it cure), like a gelcoat - it will stop bubbles, and stop the heat of the resin affecting the clay. Resin heats up the most over large areas.
However .... do lots of research first.

[Mermaid Wesley]

Oh good to know :) I'm going to mess with sculpy and hopefully I won't have to buy any more clay. Also I'm glad it's working for you!


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[Seatan]

Smooth-Cast is an epoxy resin. Polyester resin is the really cheap stuff people use sometimes on boats. I don't think Smooth On sells any polyester resins.

My latest piece actually came out okay. There are bubbles inside, but on on the actual surface where your mold will happen, it's fine. I don't think there is any way to keep the resin from affecting Monster clay--it melts when heated. That's kind of its "thing." Put a blow dryer on it and it gets drippy, leave it out in the air and it gets super hard. They guys at Reynolds think that when the Monster starts to soften it releases chemicals from its oily mixture. Hence creating the "volcanic rock" effect. For some reason adding a powder helped it, but the Plastilina is a lot better--you don't have to add anything and it comes out pretty nicely.

[Odette]

Smooth On's Smooth-Cast Colormatch resin. It's actually really easy to mix (1:1 ratio) and you don't have to stir it for more than thirty seconds or so. Then you just pour it in and wait. No smell, no mess, and it's clear. The only downside--it doesn't like oily clays that get really soft with heat. (AKA Monstermaker). It bubbles up like CRAZY leaving you with a coral like texture, sort of like volcanic rock. What did you use? Silicone? Shell shock?

hmNever thought resin would work, cool. I used all sorts of different things each tail was done a little different, but as for molding scales I have done whatever my sister said. (she worked in special FX for awhile) so one time it was clay and that cement stuff ultra something, cutting sheets, wire impressions, other clays, this cheaper latex mold stuff that comes in a round white plastic jar. I literally took whatever I could find in the workshop and tried it out. I applied scales by sewing and gluing, Silicone counting as a glue too.

[Seatan]

hmNever thought resin would work, cool. I used all sorts of different things each tail was done a little different, but as for molding scales I have done whatever my sister said. (she worked in special FX for awhile) so one time it was clay and that cement stuff ultra something, cutting sheets, wire impressions, other clays, this cheaper latex mold stuff that comes in a round white plastic jar. I literally took whatever I could find in the workshop and tried it out. I applied scales by sewing and gluing, Silicone counting as a glue too.

UltraCal 30? I have seen molds made of that at cosplay get togethers.

What did you use as the backing for application?

[Odette]

Oh good to know :) I'm going to mess with sculpy and hopefully I won't have to buy any more clay. Also I'm glad it's working for you!


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ooo! careful with that sculpey stuff. I tried making stuff with it and it cracks a lot. Maybe if I heated it, but I didn't want to go that far.

[Mermaid Wesley]

Ive made quite a few things with sculpy, some colors are crumbly-er than others and stuff. I'm going to try some baked and some unbaked since I have it on hand.


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[Seatan]

Let us know if it works well! I have a bunch of it, too. Not my fav clay, but it would be nice to be able to recast molds from the same sculpt.

[Mermaid Wesley]

Sure thing :) I'll probably try it Thursday or Friday


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[Odette]

UltraCal 30? I have seen molds made of that at cosplay get togethers.

What did you use as the backing for application?
Iv'e used neoprene, lycra, this mesh stuff, and I have done pure silicone but I like fabrics better.

[Winged Mermaid]

I always loved your tails (and you work in general) Odette :) Will be happy to see more from you! I too am excited to see others make individual scaled tails. I always knew mermaid tail making was evolving, especially in regards to information and tutorials, as well as wider availability and lower prices in the market place. It's been awesome seeing it go from hardly anyone knew how to make a fabric tail, to fabric tails galore, then neoprene, neoprene and latex, neoprene and silicone (caulking), and finally full platinum silicone. I wondered where it would go from there.. now it seems it's individually scaled silicone! I wonder where it will go next!

[PearlieMae]

Odette, I had no idea you did individual scales until you mentioned it last night! I would have replied then, but I only have internet on my phone at night and I was bushed!

The Colorcast resin from Smooth On is a urethane resin, with a pot life of a couple of minutes and a cure time of 15-30 minutes. Resins like this heat up the thicker the pour is, not over a larger surface area.

Do you color your scales before you assemble the tail or do you paint it afterwards?

Also, let me know if you have issue with Sculpey/polymer clays...I've been working with the stuff for decades!

[Aquarianne]

I just did a 10 by 8 inch patch of scales in sculpey, so I can attach them in small sheets. Does this work just as well, or should I break up the patch and just do rows? I feel like a small patch will save me a bit of time and be just as good as rows, but I'd like some expert advice! :D

Also, do you allow water to vent through your tail with this method? I'm not sure if I should be aiming to completely seal my tail from water as much as possible, or let it flow through. I'm putting latex scales on a spandex or powermesh tail base. I'd prefer to let it vent, but then I'm afraid it will pool inside the bottom of the tail and create drag as I swim, and no amount of hidden vents around the fluke may be able to drain fast enough to cut down on drag!! Thoughts?

[PearlieMae]

I have no idea yet about sealing it completely, but I have vents in it now and will be testing it.

As for patches/rows, I tested that very early, but I'm glad I went with individual scales...lots more flexibility and you don't have to worry about matching them up.

Julz is my go-to regarding latex questions!

[Mermaid Lily_Pad]

Soooo pretty! It must take forever to attach all of the scales.

[PearlieMae]

Once you get them placed the way you like them, the adhesion process goes pretty quick. MAKING the scales takes the most time.

(EDIT: Sorry, not trying to overtake your thread!)

[PearlieMae]

Odette, are your scales attached just at the top?

[Odette]

Odette, I had no idea you did individual scales until you mentioned it last night! I would have replied then, but I only have internet on my phone at night and I was bushed!

The Colorcast resin from Smooth On is a urethane resin, with a pot life of a couple of minutes and a cure time of 15-30 minutes. Resins like this heat up the thicker the pour is, not over a larger surface area.

Do you color your scales before you assemble the tail or do you paint it afterwards?

Also, let me know if you have issue with Sculpey/polymer clays...I've been working with the stuff for decades!

No worries. Iv'e been gone for a long time. lol This resin thing is really neat technique. You are so talented! Can't wait for you to swim in your creations!
I colored them before with liquid tints, but it takes so much time and tint so I prefer to paint them all afterwards.
And thank you! It would be nice to make little accents with polymer clays in the future. ^-^

[Odette]

Odette, are your scales attached just at the top?
Nope.They are all attached to the base starting from the bottom to the top.
and don't worry about taking over the thread. Everyone wants to know more about how all the individual-scaled tails are made. The individual scale technique is on the rise!

I plan to share more on how I make my tails little by little as others finally discover what I did. It's really exciting to see how minds can think alike with time.

[Seatan]

Pearlie, Odette can your scales lift up at all or did the final coat pretty much lock them down? I see FinFolk had done it in a way where you can lift the ends of each scale and it looks pretty cool!

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=318360491661229&id=126859280811352&refsrc=https%3A%2F%2Fm.facebook.com%2FFinfolkProdu ctions%2Fposts%2F318386104992001&_rdr

[Odette]

Pearlie, Odette can your scales lift up at all or did the final coat pretty much lock them down? I see FinFolk had done it in a way where you can lift the ends of each scale and it looks pretty cool!

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=318360491661229&id=126859280811352&refsrc=https%3A%2F%2Fm.facebook.com%2FFinfolkProdu ctions%2Fposts%2F318386104992001&_rdr
Mine lift. It's how I am able to have them retract in and if there is some kind of problem with the one scale or the tail isn't fitting like it used to, it's easier to fix because i only have to carefully remove the problem area and there will still be no seam problems once its corrected.

[Odette]

I always loved your tails (and you work in general) Odette :) Will be happy to see more from you! I too am excited to see others make individual scaled tails. I always knew mermaid tail making was evolving, especially in regards to information and tutorials, as well as wider availability and lower prices in the market place. It's been awesome seeing it go from hardly anyone knew how to make a fabric tail, to fabric tails galore, then neoprene, neoprene and latex, neoprene and silicone (caulking), and finally full platinum silicone. I wondered where it would go from there.. now it seems it's individually scaled silicone! I wonder where it will go next!
Thanks! :hug:=)
I totally agree. The evolution of tail making on here is a beautiful thing. I can't wait to see the new era of tails.
I myself have one more tail-making trick up my sleeve that I think could take it even further if it's not too complicated.

[PearlieMae]

I had thought about leaving them so they lift, but I live on a lake and just the idea of cleaning under each of these after each swim made MY head swim! So I am covering my tail with a 'slime' coat of silicone to seal them down. If need be, I can always cut out and replace a bad scale by carefully excising it with an Xacto. I have duplicates of most colors and sizes and can always pour new scales to match the ones I remove.

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[Odette]

I can see that. Good idea! I have that problem when I do gigs at Valley of the Moon. The place is made up of a bunch of top soil and rough cement. After cleaning my tail, I still find some little bits of leaves from my pond in between scales. lol

[Mermaid Wesley]

I've always loved the look of your tails odette! Who knew I would end housing a similar method! Lol


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[Seatan]

Yikes I didn't think about cleaning under them!!!! THAT is serious food for thought!

[Odette]

I've always loved the look of your tails odette! Who knew I would end housing a similar method! Lol


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Thank you! That's why I like keeping secrets. Then awesome stuff like this happens and other methods are made and improvements happen on their own. It's beautiful =)

[Odette]

Yikes I didn't think about cleaning under them!!!! THAT is serious food for thought!
It's not too bad. Only had a few tiny leaves in there that I didn't know of. Sand will rinse out just fine. Just apply the scales at the top part so you can get in there later if you need to. =)

[Arella]

What's the stretch like on an individually scaled tail? I would think it might have less stretch because of all the separate components?

[PearlieMae]

Mine is very stretchy and it's built on a powermesh base. I tried mine on before attaching the fluke (which I am still working on) and you can see how stretchy it is...It fits me like a glove and isn't baggy at all!


http://youtu.be/CMatS1wcMEc

The video is set to private, so please don't share it around...and I've lost 15 lbs since then! I've also since added several inches to the top of the tail to cover my round tum :D

[Odette]

What's the stretch like on an individually scaled tail? I would think it might have less stretch because of all the separate components?
Mine has a good stretch to it. Maybe stretches less than an inch. half an inch? It's stretchy. lol

[Odette]

Mine is very stretchy and it's built on a powermesh base. I tried mine on before attaching the fluke (which I am still working on) and you can see how stretchy it is...It fits me like a glove and isn't baggy at all!


http://youtu.be/CMatS1wcMEc

The video is set to private, so please don't share it around...and I've lost 15 lbs since then! I've also since added several inches to the top of the tail to cover my round tum :D
O my gosh its AWESOME! I am so proud of your hard work. I can't wait till you swim! :hug:
I know that cat hair problem lol.
Nice patio!

[PearlieMae]

Thank you! That's my deck overlooking the lake :mermaid kiss:


Cat hair and silicone could be a secret ingredient used for stomp pads and areas that need extra reinforcement. Let me know if you need some! ;)

[Arella]

Oh the pain of putting tails on lol I hate that part so much. Thanks for sharing the vid! Much easier to see the stretch :) So did you just attach the scales to the powermesh or cast a smooth piece of silicone with powermesh and then attach the scale to that? I'm just starting my own silicone tail and am thinking of scratching what little I have so far and going with individual scales.

[Seatan]

She attached the scales to the powermesh then when that cured turned it inside out and did a layer on the inside. So it IS lined with silicone, but she didn't put that silicone on first.

Reference: This Thread (http://mernetwork.com/index/showthread.php?6109-PearlieMae-s-Silicone-Tail-Journey&highlight=pearlie+mae%27s)

[nataliethegypsy]

I'm currently making an individual scale tail and I love the way it look, it has taken longer than I thought but I'm happy with it!!!

[Arella]

Perfect thanks for the link!

[Odette]

I used some sort of mesh before but I don't know what it is. I got it in a scrap pile a long time ago and put a few scales on it but it felt funny to me. I need to find that scrap. Maybe you can tell me if its power mesh. :confused:

[Mermaid Wesley]

Odette I shared a picture of my power mesh into your Facebook :)


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[Aquarianne]

Mine is very stretchy and it's built on a powermesh base. I tried mine on before attaching the fluke (which I am still working on) and you can see how stretchy it is...It fits me like a glove and isn't baggy at all!


http://youtu.be/CMatS1wcMEc

The video is set to private, so please don't share it around...and I've lost 15 lbs since then! I've also since added several inches to the top of the tail to cover my round tum :D


I laughed when you threw the tail on the chair before sitting down, like "ALL RIGHT, LET'S DO THIS THING." And at the hopping XD You are SOOO adorable!

It looks soooo fab, thank you for putting up the vid! I really wanted to see how other people get into their tails before I finish making mine :3

Also I totally believe the cat hair. I have three cats, and every last thing in my workroom that's latex-cast is covered in a sampler set of Ming, Severus and Little Friend. Thank god our turtle doesn't shed.

[suire]

OH MY GOD YOU CATS' NAMES ARE THE ABSOLUTE BEST. And I totally feel you on the cat hair thing. Jonah is a craft cuddler.......

On a separate note, I'd like to add to this coalition of suggestions that I made my tail with separate scale but, instead of creating a positive and then a negative mold of shells like PearlieMae did, I just cast my silicone right into the shells themselves. This obviously has its pros and cons. The biggest potential negative seems to be that it is impossible to make every scale exactly the same unless you cast every single one into the same shell (which would be annoying). I enjoy the lack of perfection myself, though not everyone will. The positives are that it is SUPER cheap. You don't have to spend money on resin or plaster or anything like that. I just hot glued the shells to a bit of cardboard and it works fine. And then you can pull the shells off and use them for something else.

[Mermaid Momo]

When you clean your tails do you run your hand against the way the scales are laid down and run a hose over it? Or will that damage the scales?

[PearlieMae]

I laughed when you threw the tail on the chair before sitting down, like "ALL RIGHT, LET'S DO THIS THING." And at the hopping XD You are SOOO adorable!

It looks soooo fab, thank you for putting up the vid! I really wanted to see how other people get into their tails before I finish making mine :3

Also I totally believe the cat hair. I have three cats, and every last thing in my workroom that's latex-cast is covered in a sampler set of Ming, Severus and Little Friend. Thank god our turtle doesn't shed.

Thanks! ;)

I've got Tyler (Fight Club), Moochie (she came with that name), and Poor Liz. The girls have issues, as they were abused and considered un-adoptable. I lost Tyler's brother Jack to cancer a couple years ago. :(

I am probably going to end up putting the prototype fluke on here to take on my trip Thursday and swap it out with the new fluke when I get back.


When you clean your tails do you run your hand against the way the scales are laid down and run a hose over it? Or will that damage the scales?

So far, I've just hosed it off in the tub and swished it around, but I haven't had a swim in it yet. My scales are sealed down, but I don't think running your hand against the grain will do any damage.

[Aquarianne]

Thanks! ;)

I've got Tyler (Fight Club), Moochie (she came with that name), and Poor Liz. The girls have issues, as they were abused and considered un-adoptable. I lost Tyler's brother Jack to cancer a couple years ago. :(


Those are great names! XD I'm sorry about Jack! I lost my family cat Max a while ago, he was 20 years old! He could have lived longer, but he had a lung tumor and it was kinder to put him down. I'd had him since I first moved to the states when I was 10 years old, all the way through middle school, high school, college and years later! He was a seriously boss cat.

Here is a guide to my current cats, that I drew and stuck on the fridge.

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One time I met a guy who had a cat named Magic Friend. Pretty sure he and Little Friend need to team up and fight crime.

[PearlieMae]

Hahaha! You pretty much described my gang! Ming=Mooch (aka Hook-Paw, Moochness, Chubs) she grabs your hand to pet her...overgrooms her belly, so it's kinda naked and pink;
Severus=Tyler (aka LuvrMan, Big Man, TylerMan) of course, the biggest cat I have is the biggest chicken; Little Friend=Poor Liz (aka Lizzie Girl, Girl Cat) lives in my bedroom which is the top floor of my house, suffers post declawing trauma, sometimes you can pet her but you can't pick her up. For reasons unknown, Tyler (and Jack) tries to kill her.

I LOVE your drawing!

[Ilyena]

I wonder if this can be done with latex as I don't have that much room. I have quite a bit left over after I made my Twi'lek Lekku, and from personal experience latex sinks into fabric quite well, especially my pyjama pants >_< lol

[PearlieMae]

Hahahaha! I now have silicone/stretchy yoga pants!

I can't speculate about latex, but there are some tailmakers who could give a definitive answer, but I don't see why not!

[Ilyena]

They're the weirdest feeling, though the owls on my pants won't scratch anytime soon lol!!

Experiments when I have time, though i don't think a top coat can be done with individually coloured scales as latex isn't clear and dries a skin colour

[Odette]

When you clean your tails do you run your hand against the way the scales are laid down and run a hose over it? Or will that damage the scales?
I just spray it down in the tub. You can run your hand against the scales or stick your finger in to scoop stuff out, but I never need to do that. :rainbow:

[Odette]

Those are great names! XD I'm sorry about Jack! I lost my family cat Max a while ago, he was 20 years old! He could have lived longer, but he had a lung tumor and it was kinder to put him down. I'd had him since I first moved to the states when I was 10 years old, all the way through middle school, high school, college and years later! He was a seriously boss cat.

Here is a guide to my current cats, that I drew and stuck on the fridge.

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One time I met a guy who had a cat named Magic Friend. Pretty sure he and Little Friend need to team up and fight crime.
:swoon:

[Odette]

Odette I shared a picture of my power mesh into your Facebook :)


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Thanks! I think I did use it before, but I need to find that scrap and make sure.

[lasserine]

Had this idea about 2 years ago. Sadly never went anywhere with it. I did have a idea on how to make the scales, but I need to find out what shape I want them to be in. Finding that is the tricky part.

[Odette]

Had this idea about 2 years ago. Sadly never went anywhere with it. I did have a idea on how to make the scales, but I need to find out what shape I want them to be in. Finding that is the tricky part.
Once you get started, it will be a long and beautiful road. =)

[Seatan]

Odette, is your fluke silicone as well or is it fabric?

[lasserine]

Once you get started, it will be a long and beautiful road. =)

I have a idea on how to get the scales how I want them. Just need to pick a design.

[Odette]

Odette, is your fluke silicone as well or is it fabric?
Both. so much eaiser that way and i have more control over it like that. the first fin was clear and awesome, but too thin and need hard rays on the sides to help keep its shape, but i had no time and redid the tail as it is today. Not one bit translucent, but it makes me happy =)

[Odette]

I have a idea on how to get the scales how I want them. Just need to pick a design.
I'm sure once you do it will be an amazing design! :dance: