Tails and Dry Ice?

[Mermaid Kalliope]

So, I have a party that I will be doing when I get my tail for a good friend. She is going to be putting me in a non-heated jacuzzi and was wondering if she could put dry ice in as well. From what she said it will be kept where neither I nor the tail can touch it, but I think she's using the water from the pool to trigger the fog.

I gave her a few other options to use the dry ice, but she wants to get a "lagoon" effect going.

Does anyone know the safety of this? Not just for the tail, but myself as well?

Thank you!!

[TheSolitarySiren]

Dry Ice is a very interesting and beautiful tool. It has the wondrous ability to be used for a variety of things. However, Dry Ice can be very dangerous and should be used with the utmost care and safety. Dry Ice is the solid form of CO₂ or Carbon Dioxide and is used as a 'cooling agent'. More like super cool seeing the awesome effects it can do!~ It can be used to keep a freezing temperature to preserve frozen foods, ice cream, and at one time was even used to preserve dead bodies--what?! True! "Dry Ice has twice the cooling power than water ice so it's far more efficient." Fun fact: It was created by a French Chemist, Charles Thilorier.

When Dry Ice is placed in med-to-hot temperatures of water it creates the spooky yet sweet fog-like effect called Sublimation. It is used in fog machines, haunted houses, theatres, and even night clubs. Now the scary part! Exposure to Dry Ice can cause severe skin damage by 'frostbites' (don't worry Jack Frost has nothing to do with this issue!)

HANDLING

Dry Ice temperature is extremely cold at -109.3°F or -78.5°C. Always handle Dry Ice with care and wear protective cloth or leather gloves whenever touching it. An oven mitt or towel will work. If touched briefly it is harmless, but prolonged contact with the skin will freeze cells and cause injury similar to a burn.

STORAGE
Store Dry Ice in an insulated container. The thicker the insulation, the slower it will sublimate. Do not store Dry Ice in a completely airtight container. The sublimation of Dry Ice to Carbon Dioxide gas will cause any airtight container to expand or possibly explode. Keep proper air ventilation wherever Dry Ice is stored. Do not store Dry Ice in unventilated rooms, cellars, autos or boat holds. The sublimated Carbon Dioxide gas will sink to low areas and replace oxygenated air. This could cause suffocation if breathed exclusively. Do not store Dry Ice in a refrigerator freezer. The extremely cold temperature will cause your thermostat to turn off the freezer. It will keep everything frozen in the freezer but it will be used up at a faster rate. It is the perfect thing if your refrigerator breaks down in an emergency. There are also Commercial Storage Containers available.


VENTILATION
Normal air is 78% Nitrogen, 21% Oxygen and only 0.035% Carbon Dioxide. If the concentration of carbon dioxide in the air rises above 0.5%, carbon dioxide can become dangerous. Smaller concentrations can cause quicker breathing and headaches but is otherwise not harmful. If Dry Ice has been in a closed auto, van, room, or walk-in, for more than 10 minutes, open doors and allow adequate ventilation before entering. Leave area containing Dry Ice if you start to pant and breath quickly develop a headache or your fingernails or lips start to turn blue. This is the sign that you have breathed in too much CO2 and not enough oxygen. Dry Ice CO2 is heavier than air and will accumulate in low spaces. Do not enter closed storage areas that have or have had stored Dry Ice before airing out completely.


PICK-UP TIME AND TRANSPORTING
Plan to pick up the Dry Ice as close to the time it is needed as possible. It sublimates at 10%, or 5 to 10 pounds every 24 hours, whichever is greater. Carry it in a well-insulated container such as an ice chest. If it is transported inside a car or van for more than 15 minutes make sure there is fresh air. After 15 minutes with Dry Ice only in its paper bag in the passenger seat next to me, I started to breathe faster and faster as though I were running a race. I couldn't figure out why I was so out of breath until I saw the car air system was set in the re-circulated position, not fresh outside air.


BURN TREATMENT
Treat Dry Ice burns the same as a regular heat burns. See a doctor if the skin blisters or comes off. Otherwise if only red it will heal in time as any other burn. Apply antibiotic ointment to prevent infection and bandage only if the burned skin area needs to be protected.

MSDSHere are two Material Safety Data Sheet available on line:http://stores.biochem.uiowa.edu/Pages/dryicemsds.html
http://www.airgas.com/documents/pdf/001091.pdf

COUNTERTOPS
Do not leave Dry Ice on a tiled or solid surface countertop as the extreme cold could crack it.


DISPOSAL
Unwrap and leave it at room temperature in a well-ventilated area. It will sublimate from a solid to a gas.

DO NOT leave Dry Ice unattended around children.

To be honest I do not recommend you being in the same pool or Jacuzzi with the Dry Ice. Even though beverages with Dry Ice in them are safe to drink, you are still NOT suppose to touch the Dry Ice:

POOL & JACUZZI
50 to 100 pounds of Dry Ice dropped directly into a heated swimming pool will make fog for an hour or longer depending on the water temperature and the size of the Dry Ice pieces. Because of the Jacuzzi's hot water, it makes the most fog the quickest. As long as the water is kept hot, it can take 50 to 100 pounds per hour. The Dry Ice will carbonate the water for several days. If possible drain the Jacuzzi. The swimming pool will read more alkaline during this time so wait to add acid until the carbonation has dissipated. If the temperature of the water in a swimming pool, fountain, waterfall, or birdbath is too cold (less than 60°F) the Dry Ice will bubble but produce much less fog.

ADD DRY ICE TO BEVERAGES
It is OK to put Dry Ice into beverages for drinking as long as the dry ice is food grade. Use 2 to 4 pounds of Dry Ice for each gallon of room temperature punch. Use large pieces of Dry Ice not small pieces. The Dry Ice is heavier than ice and will sink to the bottom. Do not use any regular ice! The Dry Ice will do the cooling and must not be eaten or swallowed. Too much Dry Ice will freeze the beverage so have extra standing by. It will bubble and give off the most fog when the beverage is room temperature. When most of the Dry Ice has sublimated, it will surround itself with ice and float to the top. There is still a small piece of Dry Ice in the center of these ice pieces so do not serve or eat them. Carefully ladle the beverage into drinking glasses without any Dry Ice. Add regular ice to glasses for cooler drinks.

I wouldn't even put the Dry Ice in a bag then dunk it in the pool/jaccuzzi! If anything, I would feel way more safer with a Fog Machine nicely placed in a nearby area. Depending on the Fog Machine you can get really good coverage! Especially over the pool/jaccuzzi for that 'lagoon' effect. It's all about placing it in the right areas and adding the certain amount of fog. : ) Fog Machines are done with 'liquid Dry Ice' or even just Dry Ice! But at least I wouldn't be exposed to the harshness of Dry Ice. Keep in mind Fog Machines can be bought or rented.

STAGE PRODUCTIONS
Using a fog machine or buckets of hot water and a fan, many shows are enhanced by adding flowing fog. I have seen it most often in the dance of the snowflake fairies in the Nutcracker Suite, and it is frequently used in Brigadoon and Oklahoma for their dream scenes.

FOG MACHINES
A theater fog machine is generally a 30 to 55-gallon metal or plastic water barrel with a 110-volt or a 220-volt hot water heater to keep the water hot. Dry Ice is placed in a bucket with holes to allow hot water to enter. When the bucket is lowered into the hot water fog is instantly produced. The resulting water vapor fog is gently blown by a fan and directed to the desired area by an air duct tube. Fog stops whenever the bucket of Dry Ice is pulled out of the water. More recent fog machines pump heated water over a trey holding the Dry Ice. All have a GFCI breaker for safety.

Hopefully some of this information has helped you. ALWAYS do personal research about a product and safety BEFORE doing something. Do some more research yourself. Especially on Dry Ice wounds and damages before making a decision. I hope you stay safe at your event and still remember to have a fantastic time!

Source:
http://www.dryiceinfo.com
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dry_ice
http://www.dryicedirectory.com/
http://science.howstuffworks.com/inn...uestion264.htm

[Echidna]

how would dry ice give a "lagoon effect"?

it's used for cooling, and you should not touch it (frostbite).
if the space you put it in is confined (tank?), the outgassing might have toxic effects (CO2).

a fog machine would be a better option if vapors are desired.

Edit: was beaten by 2 seconds

[Mermaid Kalliope]

Thank you both! <3

I know the chemistry behind dry ice, but I wasn't sure what its prolonged effects are. I will talk to my friend about other options. I also linked her to this page so she can read it herself!

I'm going to try to go over to her house soon so we can discuss staging options.

caltuna - She's going for the dense foggy effect. Like a layer of heavy fog at the water's surface. I guess it would be more of a "bog" or "swamp" effect?

[Taylor is a Mermaid]

It's fine. In fact, I've done it before in a pool! A few years ago my father wanted a pool party for his birthday. My mom and I bought a bunch of dry ice (can't remember how many pounds, but it filled a styrofoam cooler) and dumped it in the pool for the party. There were several kids there, some as young as toddlers, and no one got sick. We swam around in the dry ice pool and it was the coolest. thing. ever. Because it was out in the open, there is very little risk of breathing problems. The effect doesn't last that long, but it is pretty neat. It will cool the water slightly.
As far as touching dry ice: it is safe-ish (still risky) so long as you move it around very quickly and it does not make extended contact with one area of skin. My parents are both former theater teachers specializing in technical theater and special effects, and my dad ran a haunted house for years. Dry ice has been a big part of my childhood! My dad used to even (now don't freak out) put dry ice in his mouth and blow it out to pretend to be a dragon when I was kid. He would never let me do it; it's a little dangerous because you have to keep moving the piece of dry ice very quickly so that it doesn't "burn" you. As long as you're doing this outdoors and no one touches the dry ice directly, you will be safe.
The only time I've ever had a negative experience with dry ice was during a haunted house when I was maybe 8. I was lying under the floor of the haunted house staring out of a plexiglass window with dry ice around me. I looked like I was frozen alive. It should have been safe, but it was not ventilated well enough, so after a while the CO2 started to replace the oxygen in the air, and I started to have a hard time breathing. BUT as soon as the person standing on the plexiglass moved, I was able to lift up the plexiglass and get a good breath. I was just fine, but we abandoned that part of the haunted house.
Here's a picture of the dry ice pool party. We dumped the dry ice out of the bags and into the bottom of the pool. We warned everyone about touching it directly, and we were all safe. Lots of fun!

[AptaMer]

Thanks for posting your personal experiences, Taylor! That's very helpful to know.

[Mermaid Dottie]

I know that when we worked the witches' area at Haunted Hollow, We would always have dry ice in our cauldron. A good idea is to poke some holes in the bag and just drop the whole bag in the water, that way there's little to no chance of freeze-burning yourself by touching it.
I think it also makes the fog last longer, but I have no evidence to prove that.

[AniaR]

I have a pretty humidifier that I use at gigs, it's a ceramic flat circle that vibrates at a high frequency in the water, and creates the same effect as fog or dry ice, but it's only water! they're all over the internet!

[Blondie]

Something inside of me makes me think that silicone/latex and dry ice will not work. If it touches it, it'll beak off. Just from seeing this...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-0y-xPG5n5g

[Mermaid Kalliope]

Oh yikes! That was... o.o Meep! Liquid Nitrogen is much much colder than dry ice, but still! ><

Raina: My roommate's dad has one of those! Except he messed with it so it doesn't really work any more. Boo... I love those things!

Taylor: Whoa! That is so cool! I know for a fact that she wants the effect to last an hour at the least, but from what she's told me, her family already has fog machines, so she'll just go with those. Phew. haha

I don't want to risk damaging my tail right after I get it!



Thank you all so very much! It's been super duper helpful!!

[artorias]

Hi all, I recently had to look for an ice maker for quite some time because I wanted to throw a Christmas party and I wanted to do everything at the highest level. I couldn't find what I was looking for for a long time, but then I was lucky enough to stumble upon this ice block maker which was perfect for me because it was inexpensive and I was able to make tons of ice for the party with it!