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Thread: Egg or live birth?

  1. #1

    Egg or live birth?

    Hey!

    I'm not sure if this is the right place for this thread, but there was a mention in another thread about the egg birth vs. live birth argument, and thought I would start a place where people can fight and discuss this matter in its own place. MAY THE DEBATE COMMENCE.... NOW!
    All that glitters is not gold,
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    Deep roots are not touched by the frost.

    From the ashes a fire shall be broken,
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    Renewed shall be blade that was broken,
    The crownless again shall be king.

  2. #2
    Senior Member Euro Pod Echidna's Avatar
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    There was a thread about this...somewhere in the sexuality forum, methinks.

    There are no recordings of child mermaid sightings though, so there might be a third variant:
    mermaids are neither live-bearing mammals, nor egg-laying fish.

    They're actually amphibians (which explains why there are merfolk in both fresh- and saltwater).
    The spawn lies around somewhere, looking like something entirely different for a long while.
    (therefor, no baby mermaid sightings.)

    Eventually, they grow, but still look like something else (maybe human? the perfect disguise), until adulthood, when they undergo a rapid and violent metamorphosis, change into merfolk, jump into the next body of water, and are (almost) never seen again.

    >> I had this revelation through an incredible vision, so don't steal

  3. #3
    Senior Member Euro Pod Echidna's Avatar
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    one of the previous threads
    http://mernetwork.com/index/showthre...ight=reproduce

    there are probably lots more.

  4. #4
    Senior Member Pod of Oceania Ilyena's Avatar
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    How about a poll?
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  5. #5
    Senior Member Chesapeake Pod Merman Dan's Avatar
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    I like the idea that mermaids are like monotremes, egg-laying mammals, but their fishy bits contribute to the reproductive process. Have you ever seen a mermaid's purse, aka shark/skate egg case? Some cat sharks, after emerging from their egg case, have bellybuttons (umbilical scars). I envision merlings hatching in a similar manner, even to the point of having an egg-tooth that dislodges after cutting through the mermaid's purse from the inside. Imagine how rare and wondrous a mermaid's egg-tooth would be!

    (Formerly known as olius)

  6. #6
    Senior Member Undisclosed Pod
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    I tell kids there are different mermaid species all over the world. (there are different mythos all over!). Some are more fishy and lay eggs, have scales, and gills. Some are more like mammals and breathe air, have smooth tails, and have live babies. Some are always mermaids, some can change into humans.

    I actually really like the mermaid forest/mermaid saga for how mermaids are made, and I also really like the lost voices idea for how mermaids are made

    I also thought it would be cool if mermaids were born fully grown in a big ol egg. Imagine someone walking along the shore, poking this weird jellyfish like thing, and a mermaid spills out.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Chesapeake Pod Merman Dan's Avatar
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    And then there are those who we not born merfolk but gained their tails through magical means, as is the case with my mer-sona.
    (Formerly known as olius)

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    Senior Member Chesapeake Pod Fun123joker's Avatar
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    once when i was in tail at a cove this little girl came up to me and ask me so many questions. the most unique one was "how are mermaid babies born?" i could tell she didnt know where babies came from. i told her that mermaids hatched from pearls and the color of the pearl is the color of thier tail. (i got all of it from mermaid melody) i played a game where the sea witch (no tail not mermaid) was born from an egg.

    Quote Originally Posted by caltuna View Post
    The spawn lies around somewhere, looking like something entirely different for a long while.
    (therefor, no baby mermaid sightings.)

    Eventually, they grow, but still look like something else (maybe human? the perfect disguise), until adulthood, when they undergo a rapid and violent metamorphosis, change into merfolk, jump into the next body of water, and are (almost) never seen again.

    >> I had this revelation through an incredible vision, so don't steal
    what if they did what the catfish does with the cichlid

    make thier babies look human so the humans can take care of them, take the life of a human and go on to be a mermaid

    i think they leave thier parents at a young age to go out and find another sea

    what if in a pod there is one who watches the offspring,no idea is a bad idea


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    Senior Member Euro Pod Echidna's Avatar
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    If you consider mermaids waterfairies instead of an aquatic animal, you'd find some similarities with how fairies put their young into human's care until they are grown (changelings).

    There are also stories of how Nck (male freshwater spirits) or waterdragons (they're the same thing mostly) kidnap human women to take care of their offspring for many years, as if they themselves weren't able to do it.
    The woman in question is usually released after 7 years or so, laden with riches from the sea.

  10. #10
    Personally, I like the idea of my mersona having hatched from a pearly-colored sort of dragon egg (if only because her kind, in my head, based off a species of shapeshifting sea-dragons). Her egg washed up on a small beach and was found by a man on a fishing trip, who took it home to his wife. The egg hatched, and as she dried off her tail turned to legs and they raised her as a human. She didn't find out about her heritage until she was much older. I'm working on a novel sort of thing about my mersona to help me flesh her out a bit more and to help me connect more with her character.

    I love "origin" stories like this because it's so cool to see all the different things everybody comes up with for their mersonas.

  11. #11
    All the mythology I grew up with says live birth. And the capacity to breed with humans. If not an unusually high fertility rate with humans as opposed to comparable couplings between two humans or two of the merfolk. Which actually seems not all that unusual in dealing with humanoid creatures in the mythologies.

    So I had always assumed live birth because it was so matter of fact in our stories. I didn't even realize that egg-laying versus live birth was a debate until I started talking to Westerners about mermaids. Lol!
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  12. #12
    Senior Member Euro Pod Echidna's Avatar
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    Aren't the Persian merfolk just humans with the ability to live below the sea though?
    No tails.

    Anything but live birth wouldn't make sense in such a setting.

  13. #13
    Depends on how you interpret the text and which story you're reading.
    آناهیتا پری دریایی
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  14. #14
    Senior Member Euro Pod Echidna's Avatar
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    probably, although it was my understanding that there were 2 kinds of merfolk distinct from one another, one were basically humans with the ability to live underwater (with human society down below, cattle, fields, etc), and another which was either half fish, a shapechanger, or some magical (usually monstrous) creature.

    This distinction is prevalent among many culture's legends, especially eastern Europe and Ireland.
    It's also usually stated the "human" merfolk help out fishers, whereas the "fae" merfolk ignores or kills humans.

  15. #15
    Well if you want to go be born Iranian, learn Farsi. grow up in Iran, learn all the untranslated stories, and stuff to go figue out the interpretations first hand in their cultural context, by all means.
    آناهیتا پری دریایی
    Anahita, The Persian Mermaid
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  16. #16
    Senior Member Euro Pod Echidna's Avatar
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    no thanks.
    Already did that for the 7 cultures that interested me most.

  17. #17
    Good to know. You should stick to being an expert in those ones then.
    آناهیتا پری دریایی
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  18. #18
    Senior Member Euro Pod Echidna's Avatar
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    I never claimed to be an expert in Persian lore, lol.
    Just mentioned that in the stories I read said merfolk didn't have tails.
    (Something you said yourself in the "mermaids all over the world"-thread, btw.)

    Vague claims and being passive-aggressive instead of citing some sources is rather unfruitful for a discussion.

  19. #19
    The fact that you always have some "actually it's like this" remark to say to anyone who shares something is where my passive aggressive "expert" comment comes from. You've done it in other threads to other mers on other topics, too.

    My post here didn't distinguish between either type of mermaid here, because the distinction didn't need to be made. It applied to both names. You decided to make a distinction, a wrong distinction that even went so far as to reference some versions of them as monstrous creatures to distinguish them from the other type, which I've never said, so I don't know how any confusion came about from that. And quite frankly I can't figure out why you decided to make an incorrect and unnecessary comment other than to do what it seems like you always do, which is "oh, you know something, well I know it better."

    If that's not how you mean to sound, I don't really know what to say to you because that's constantly how you come off.

    For reference I'm assuming you're talking about this:

    In Iran, there's a couple of mythologies about mermaids. They tend to be from the Persian Gulf rather than the Caspian Sea, I can imagine the presence of dolphins and dugongs has at least a little something to do with it. The two types of "mermaids" we have are "sea-people" and "sea-faeries". "Sea-people" is the generally older term associated with them. "Sea-faerie" is a bit more recent. They can both have tails, but then again, they can also both be without tails. I guess it just depends on who is telling/translating the story. The general assumption (at least nowadays for "sea faeries") is that they're tailed in the water, but time out on land dries their tails into legs.
    I state plainly that the terms are essentially interchangeable, but that sea-faerie is the more up-to-date and more consistently defined term.
    آناهیتا پری دریایی
    Anahita, The Persian Mermaid
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  20. #20
    Putting aside my popcorn here and chime in: I agree with Anahita. Caltuna you did the exact same thing in another thread when I talked about mermaid stories from Vietnam and China.
    The SeaGlass Siren

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