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Thread: The man with the 22 minute breath hold

  1. #1
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    The man with the 22 minute breath hold

    If you didnt see I shared this on mernetwork fb and added him on FB he's super cool!

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/1...n_2144734.html

    Also here is his reddit ama where he addresses the most common questions: http://www.facebook.com/l.php?u=http...2F&h=wAQHRiG3s

    He holds the gusiness world record and is also a scientist. He does such cool things, read up about him

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    Senior Member Euro Pod Echidna's Avatar
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    While it's indeed cool to be able to stay that long under water, I've never quite gotten the notion of doing apnea records after breathing pure oxygen.

    Not that it's no longer an impressive feat, but where is the appeal?
    It's like wanting to set a new bicycle sprint record, and using a bicycle with a motor, if you get what I mean.

    That's why I don't much care about oxygen-induced records and their holders.
    I like the natural, traditional way that has been practiced for several thousand years.

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    why do you think it's less of a feat because someone has breathed oxygen? I'm not following your logic..

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    plus his previous record of 20 minutes wasn't with oxygen

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    Senior Member Pod of Oceania Mermaid Jaffa's Avatar
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    Wow! He would make an excellent merman!
    Formerly known as ireneho

  6. #6
    Oxygen or no oxygen, that's flipping amazing! Imagine how amazing it must feel to be underwater like that. I bet to do a breath hold like that you have to be in a meditative or trance like state too, so I bet that's just bliss!

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    Senior Member Euro Pod Echidna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AniaR View Post
    plus his previous record of 20 minutes wasn't with oxygen
    erm no, that was, of course, with oxygen too.
    No one could hold their breath normally longer than 7-8 minutes and not be brain damaged or dead afterward.
    And that's a generous estimate.

    in April, after inhaling pure oxygen, he held his breath for 20 minutes and 10 seconds in a tank full of sharks at the Kattegat Centre in Grenaa
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stig_Severinsen


    Besides, I said that it still is an impressive feat, just one I don't find particularly appealing, mostly due to the oxygen records being quoted everywhere and conveniently leaving out the oxygen bit.

    Which leads after a while to the false notion that apneists have an average breathhold of 10min or something, and they don't.
    Do you realize how dangerous such a false expectation can be?
    Even world record holders probably are in trouble if they aren't back after 4 or 5 minutes on a dive.

    That aside, the guy has done amazing things.

    I'm just far more impressed by his 2:11 minutes underwater swim than I would be if he had sat an hour underwater using some tricks.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Euro Pod Talia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AniaR View Post
    why do you think it's less of a feat because someone has breathed oxygen? I'm not following your logic..
    It is less of a feat because of this:
    The air we breath is composed of a 78% of nitrogen and 20.9% of oxygen, with some residual percentage of other gases. When you breath normally, your body has to extract the useful 20.9% of oxygen of the rest. So with each breath you take, you actually have to discard a big percentage that is not usable.

    If you breath air with a higher percentage of oxygen (not 100% because that is toxic), your body can use a bigger percentage of what you are breathing, which means you cells have a lot more of oxygen that they are used to have, and they take a lot more time to use it all. And that means you need to breath less frequently.

    So yes, I agree with Echidna that it is less of an acomplishment if you don't do it "the old way". Even though, since the record keeps going up (I remember the last one at 18 minutes), that means it is something that it has to be trained too.

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    No one could hold their breath normally longer than 7-8 minutes and not be brain damaged or dead afterward.
    No actually, that's incorrect. He addresses this on his reddit AMA where it is explained that many people think that but the truth is the brain damage comes from the heart not pumping the oxygen to the brain (cardiovascular collapse), or a block in the arteries - not actually from not breathing, but rather obstruction or collapse preventing circulating oxygen to the brain. So no, it's not a matter of breath hold length causing brain damage, but rather if the breath holding causes the heart to stop working properly- then that can stop the blood flow and cause the brain damage. Blacking out underwater can kill you though and cause brain damage. It is still being studied but so far no major evidence to suggest breath holding alone causes damage. A lot of internet links will say "holding your breath causes brain damage!" but when you actually look at the information they're using to back it, it's the act of blacking out that the studies are based on, or exposure to things like the bends. As a CPR Instructor, this is also what I'm taught and why the Lifesaving society has now changed it that it's more important to do compression (keep the blood flowing) than to give breaths, so while people can still give breaths we now teach that if you aren't able to/don't want to because of the situation, just keep doing compression. (this is becoming standard world wide, and the standards for CPR and first aid are actually pilot tested here in NS!)

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    http://tierneylab.blogs.nytimes.com/...ur-brain/?_r=0

    Two seconds on google says breathing pure oxygen is pretty standard in the free diving world to prevent several health issues that can occur and often enforced for liability when trying to obtain what gets labelled as "extreme breath holding", I see nothing less in the feat by taking a safety measure . Extreme breath holding wouldn't be possible safely without it according to many articles I'm reading. So I see nothing less in it given it's the standard. That's my opinion though. I am still impressed. I also find him incredibly knowledgeable on a lot of subjects and I think it's awesome he allows himself to be so closely studied in order for science to continue to learn more about the body's capacity. Moreover, Guinness does separate breath holding between using oxygen and not using oxygen. Some people get around this by hyperventilating to get more of the oxygen from the air, which is how David Blaine did it. And while many do breathe oxygen before they go down it has to be heavily monitored or they can experience toxicity. It is not without risk as well.

    I also find it interesting too that he can only hold his breath past 8 minutes above the water and after looking a bit online it looks like that can be fairly standard for free divers to do LESS on land than they can in the water.

    Echidna- I guess I just don't get how you can fail to be impressed by so many things that get posted. It seems to be a theme with a lot of what you post. You're certainly a hard mermaid to impress.

    I think this is crazy impressive. I don't see it as any less given the fact he used oxygen since it's standard for extreme breath hold. People do loads of things to enhance their capabilities to reach their goals. I don't think it's fair to compare it to a bike with a motor. I think that would be like having an actual oxygen tank underwater with him to breathe from if he got desperate. You make it seem like it's on par with using steroids.

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    Oxygen or no oxygen, that's flipping amazing! Imagine how amazing it must feel to be underwater like that. I bet to do a breath hold like that you have to be in a meditative or trance like state too, so I bet that's just bliss!
    Yeah! He talks a lot about the use of yoga and meditation to help him hit these numbers and how the time passes differently for him down there. So neat!

  11. #11
    Senior Member Euro Pod Echidna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AniaR View Post
    Echidna- I guess I just don't get how you can fail to be impressed by so many things that get posted. It seems to be a theme with a lot of what you post. You're certainly a hard mermaid to impress.
    First of all; I said I was impressed by things he has done- namely, the longest underwater swim on breathhold (150 metres in 2 minutes and 11 seconds), to name just one.

    If I explain again why I find records done under oxygen not appealing, I'd be repeating myself.
    It may be standard practice in static apnea, but that doesn't make it any more appealing to me.
    And steroids are quite a standard practice among athletes too, even though no one talks about it.
    It's actually quite the analogy.

    I saw a TV special about breathholding not too long ago.
    The moderator, neither an athlete nor a swimmer and entirely new to breathholding, was given a dose of oxygen.
    He managed a 5 min breathhold right off the bat.
    He was then over the course of the show taught to use meditation and breathing techniques, and at the end of the special, he got oxygen and tried again.
    That time, he was about 9 minutes, iirc.

    Now take someone who is into freediving and breathholding all their lives.
    Does it still sound so incredible?

    I'm not trying to talk you out of being impressed.
    My opinion about it stands though.
    I think the whole deal is a trick to get those big, flashy numbers that let people who don't know much about it flabbergasted- and create unrealistic expectations of what is and could be possible under normal circumstances.

    It's fine if someone does this to have the experience to stay that long under.
    It's their body after all.


    Lastly, please refrain from ad hominem comments, because "I fail to be impressed".
    Or implying that I "constantly have a theme of being not impressed" (lol?).
    I'm not attacking you or disagreeing with you, I disagree with the practice.

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    Honestly I just fine your tone comes off that way in a lot of your posts and it tends to undermine the content or the point you're trying to make. Your posts dont come across critical to me (and many others as have been pointed out in other threads) but more of a put down because you don't like or approve of something. I don't see the point of frequently letting people know you don't care about something or aren't impressed by it in such detail so consistantly beyond trying to put down the post. It's not like you usually say "Oh not my thing, but that's cool" You typically have a posting pattern where you barely acknowledge what the post is, then post several paragraphs being negative. It happened in the thread about mermaids of colour (which really offended a lot of people and bordered on being racist with the comments), it happens in threads talking about materials, it happened in the thread about being vegetarian, it happens in threads talking about preferences for underwater protection (nose plugs, goggles etc). I find everyone else manages to express whether they like or dislike something without putting it down and trying to prove to others why it's not as great, but your posts often come off through your choice of words and tone like your thoughts are the absolute truth and other people are less for falling for whatever the content of the post is. (even word choices like that suggest people are gullible if they dont think the same way you do) In this post, you can express not being impressed with it on the same level I (or clearly the people in the article, or the AMA) are without suggesting there isn't any appeal, without undermining the feat .. I mean it's great you back peddled a bit in your second post but maybe you don't realize just how frequently you instantly jump to shooting things down in threads. I mean it happens so much that before I even read your posts I KNEW you'd be posting something about how it's not that great or you don't approve or you know more. Talia's comment is a good example of being objective with facts without undermining the content of the post or in this case a person. You do this in most threads so I'm not trying to single it out like it's an issue between you and me, you and I do agree occasionally on things. I just rarely see you post many positive posts. Most certainly in some threads for sure, but I feel (and others have expressed to me the same feeling) a lot of your posts have this negative critical tone that honestly aren't always warranted. Not everything has to be approached that way, and you don't always have to post that you don't like something or disagree with something either (something I learned after I felt my own posts were just too many disagreeing so I just stopped posting in certain threads unless it was of particular importance to me)

    Anyway, that's just some context for where my comment came from. It's not my intention to personally attack you and I hope it doesn't come off that way. I'm certainly not telling you you need to be more positive or fake being positive for things, it would just be nice to see certain things left out of your posts that put the content down. I don't think you need to do that ALL of the time there are certainly situations where it's warranted. But I hope you'll consider it. Maybe take a look back through your post history from the past few months and look at the responses you elicit from people. I feel like threads that aren't controversial in the slightest suddenly become so because of that. But you're your own person, so take it or leave it

    I personally think it's unfair to say "I think the whole deal is a trick to get those big, flashy numbers that let people who don't know much about it flabbergasted- and create unrealistic expectations of what is and could be possible under normal circumstances." that undermines it as well. It maybe your opinion, but what he does was regulated through Guinness and no one looks at any world record and creates an expectation that those things are typically possible. It's pretty impressive to most of us who do know things about it. Why imply it's being deceitful? It's like you've assigned this whole other shadowy meaning to a guy beating his own world record.
    Last edited by AniaR; 11-29-2014 at 03:57 PM.

  13. #13
    Senior Member Euro Pod Echidna's Avatar
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    ^^ye, I'm not going to quote all of that.
    regarding the threads you mentioned:

    I see now that it was a mistake to always simply walk away from drama, or replies asking for drama and endless back and forth (for the sake of not derailing a thread) instead of speaking up for myself.

    You mention the vegetarian thread, where someone off-handedly demanded all vegetarians should rather be vegans.
    He/she posted a generic "you bad meat eater" in response before realizing I am vegetarian.
    You probably didn't realize this either, nor read that thread properly.
    Show me where I'm putting down vegetarians or vegans or anyone really.

    This is just an example, because frankly I don't know which of the "material threads" you mean and where I "put down" someone's material choice.
    (Unless it was one of the threads where someone asked if a holographic fabric was suitable for a tail, and I responded that it wasn't the best.)

    I post a lot to many different topics, so I cannot say something very specific.
    Except maybe the Merfolk of colour thread, where I said that light skintone is/was a widespread beauty ideal, especially in Asia.
    You can be offended by that or not, but it's true, and calling me racist because of stating a fact is pretty low.

    I may come off as critical often, because instead of being phony and flattery, I always speak my mind.
    Sadly, this seems to be a privilege in this forum that doesn't pertain to me.

    I could go on for pages and make examples how you criticized people harshly for something, while you did the very same thing you were criticizing in another thread yourself-
    there are quite the double standards around in this forum sadly, to that extent that some members who I know to be very nice, kind and friendly even made threads asking what they were allowed to say and what not, while others just quit.

    Pardon me if I don't dig up all those threads for you, my time is a bit too valuable to endlessly squibble on a forum about the way others post.
    Anyways, I'm fed up with it, and will stop posting.

    Feel free to have a party with the members who hate me, many of whom constantly write in a down-putting, aggressive manner, but never receive any criticism for it lol.

    Echidna out.

  14. #14
    Though I don't have much place to speak, I'm going to put my input here. I don't post too often, but I do read things on mernetwork literally every day. There are several things I do have to say.

    In Raina's defense I would like to say that through all the posts of hers that I've read, I've never thought any of them to be rude or offensive. I believe she expresses her opinion maturely, yet makes sure she never makes it offensive. She isn't afraid to express her opinion, but she does it in a manner that doesn't come off as harsh and doesn't make people wonder about their own thoughts on subjects.

    I understand you were saying that breathing oxygen vs regular air isn't the same, but 22 minutes is still VERY impressive. None of us could beat that even if we tried and breathed in oxygen too. I think sometimes we tend to say (or type) things that we don't really think whether or not we could offend someone.

    Let's all just say that he did a good job doing what he loves and set aside our different opinions
    Formerly known as Savannah Staver

  15. #15
    I think that:




    Not saying anyone here is a jerk either, just thought it was relevant.

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    ^Totally. Forums are for discussions, after all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Echidna View Post
    Pardon me if I don't dig up all those threads for you, my time is a bit too valuable to endlessly squibble on a forum about the way others post. Anyways, I'm fed up with it, and will stop posting.
    I hope you don't mean for threads outside this one, you're one of my favorite forum members to read, for the reasons you posted yourself that seem to be the reasons some people don't like you? Well, that is what the ignore button is for.

    Anyway, I'm fascinated by all of the breath holding stuff. And by what I learned from Echidna's replies, because I really don't know enough about it all. I can barely hold my breath for 20 seconds, my asthma-addled lungs get mad at me for that. So I am totally amazed by the idea of 20 mins, no matter how he did it. But it does sound like a record which doesn't really reflect what the general practice is.

    Either way, nifty.

  17. #17
    What a cool record! Mine is at 1:02 right now. My family smokes--my parents and my sisters!

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    Ah I understand Oceanne, my entire family (immediate and most of my other family) smoke - dad stopped after my mom passed from lung cancer. My brother and sister both still smoke as do thier other halves. But to get back to topic, I find this, with oxygen or not, its absolutely fintastic!
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